NoGodBlog.com

Couldn't agree with you more. Solution? Help make the mixing of politics and religion taboo by speaking out in favor of building The Wall higher and stronger in law and our national psyche.

I don't think Obama would be spending much time talking about religion at all if it were not for the incessant calls for "clarification" from the right-wing hit-media.

I agree this is a witch hunt, but I am still troubled by the church Obama belongs to.

Let me be clear about the fact that I recognize that he has the right to be a xian and hold the highest office in the land. But the official website of his church bothers me, specifically the statement that it has a "non-negotiable COMMITMENT TO AFRICA".

Trinity Church of Christ,Chicago
http://www.tucc.org/about.htm

I am also greatly troubled by the fact that he belongs to a church that honors Louis Farrakan, a man who has made hateful statements about Jews, whites and homosexuals.

This is the country that gives him the freedom to worship as he pleases, to worship in fact at a black church which has a "non-negotiable" commitment to another country. I see no mention of a commitment to the United States of America, the country the man hopes to lead.

I would find this statement objectionable if instead of Africa any other country was the receipient of his church's committment, even if it was Great Britian. And suppose that in the future a Muslim should be a candidate for president and belong to a mosque which might have a "non-negotiable committment to Iran or an another Middle-Eastern country? How should we feel about that? How would that be different than a committment to Africa?

I am a citizen of the USA and I want my president to be totally and without question committed only to my country.

Well...at least GFG has done some research...

Please Dave...it's politics. It's for the big boys. One of the rules of the game is to always keep your opponent on defense...looks like it's working...besides. Obama can speak for 45 minutes, make the weak of mind feel great, by saying absolutely nothing...

And don't worry, Obama is strong enough to handle it...just don't tease him about his ears...

Have you ever wondered if all of you Obama supporters are being played? Odd how this rookie zoomed to the top without anyone looking into his past...

Phreedm:

hey, at least we'll have the decency to admit we were wrong and support his impeachment if it turns out (unlikely) that he's a muslim/african/alien/whateverthehell extremist.

unlike some people and their christian extremist president.

does it bother you that george bush has made it clear that he relied on his religion for guidance in the presidency?

cause it sure bothers the hell out of some of us

I'm not saying it would be right for any president to have a higher commitment to any cause other than the wellness of his constituency.

I'm just saying your hypocrisy is showing.

Re: "non-negotiable COMMITMENT TO AFRICA". This is pretty typical 'afrocentric' language - in most cases much more cultural than national. Besides, Africa is a continent, not a country. ;)

phreedm

Odd how this rookie zoomed to the top without anyone looking into his past...

So far as I've been able to tell, this guy has been more open about his past than any candidate in my living memory. And I think that's probably contributed a great deal to his success. That, and the fact that he can out-politic even the most seasoned politicals. So in that light his success isn't really "odd" at all.

Face it, he's a brilliant campaigner. Probably one of the best in American history.

Well, I,/i> heard he smokes cigarettes! Now, THAT'S far worse than being a muslim, or even an atheist! You just can't trust those smokers. And I heard it from FOX (We're FaIr and BaLAnCeD)News, so it must be true, right?
Oops, 'scuse me, I dropped an ash on my keyboard, dammit!


______
Hey R4D! Good to hear from you! Long time between rainbows.

Have you ever wondered if all of you Obama supporters are being played?

Phreeky's diseased brain is playing him and of course he never wonders.

Obama, yo-mama so fat.... uh, can anybody find a picture of Obama's mama so I can tell this joke?

QF

I have found a few images of Barak Obama's mother via google images. It appears that she was an attractive and intelligent women.
She died of ovarian and uterine cancer in 1995. Upon learning this I found myself, as a father of two, wishing out loud that she could have lived to see her son make one hell of a run for the presidency of the United States of America.

oh, that explains it all then, I heard that she wasn't allowed to get her picture taken because she was white and it would hurt Obama's campaign run. That cancer story is much less funny than what I was told though. :(

Comment from: FlyingWeasel

Does it bother you that george bush has made it clear that he relied on his religion for guidance in the presidency?

No...what bothers me is how ignorant some people can be to believe anything...

Please provide a transcript of the Presidents own words backing up your claim...you can't.

Instead you'll rely on the words of one individual who happenes to be an enemy of the US...

Prime example of blind hatred...

Comment from: rainbows4dinosaurs

So far as I've been able to tell, this guy has been more open about his past than any candidate in my living memory.

You've got to be kidding. Time will simply prove this statement wrong...

Face it, he's a brilliant campaigner. Probably one of the best in American history.

Well I can see one atheist who's been converted by the "messiah"...

R4D...I gave you alot more credit. Do you want to actually allow "a brilliant campaigner" run America in this day and age? Or do you prefer experience...?

I'll tell you what. Obama spoke for 45 minutes after his Wisconsin win...
and yet he said nothing but words to make you feel good.

Listen again and give me any substance to what his "change" will be all about...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=JfRWwZNv6FA

http://youtube.com/watch?v=R1AvNqnramA

phreedm,

Please provide a transcript of the Presidents own words backing up your claim...you can't.

You've got to be f'ing kidding me.

Bush: God Told Me to Invade Iraq

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/1007-03.htm

Did Mr. Bush ask his father for any advice? “I asked the president about this. And President Bush said, ‘Well, no,’ and then he got defensive about it,” says Woodward. “Then he said something that really struck me. He said of his father, ‘He is the wrong father to appeal to for advice. The wrong father to go to, to appeal to in terms of strength.’ And then he said, ‘There's a higher Father that I appeal to

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/15/60minutes/main612067.shtml

I could go on and on for hours, but something tells me that no matter how many quotes by bush I furnish, you will continue to live in bizarro land where up is down and left is right. The man is a religious sycophant, and you know it.

Do you want to actually allow "a brilliant campaigner" run America in this day and age? Or do you prefer experience...?

So then, I can assume you are supporting Hillary? Because I know you can't be talking about, "I know very little about the economy", and "we could be in Iraq for 100 more years", McCain.

God Damned blockquotes! I really need to stop posting in the middle of the night. I know what the time stamp says, but it was 0430 hrs CST when I got up, what seems like just a half hour ago.

Obama can speak for 45 minutes, make the weak of mind feel great, by saying absolutely nothing...

So he's the second coming of Ronald Reagan?

If only we could be lucky enough to have Reagan back in the White House.

Comment from: phreedm [Member]

Comment from: FlyingWeasel

Does it bother you that george bush has made it clear that he relied on his religion for guidance in the presidency?

No...what bothers me is how ignorant some people can be to believe anything...

Me too. I find it hard to believe that some people actaully think there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

Some people actually think that Putsch's speechifying hasn't been invoking religious imagery, when there is factual proof that it has since the day he started campaigning. It is truly amazing to me that some can willfully deceive themselves like this on a constant basis.

And, sadly, some people still think that, if they say Barack HUSSEIN Osama, er, I mean, Obama enough, the sheeple will buy their bull$hit.

phreedm's ignorance smacked down by facts again...

Ha ha ha ha...

>If only we could be lucky enough to have Reagan back in the White House.

Good idea! Let's dig him up and sit him in the oval office for the remainder of Shrub's term! He'd do a better job.

Aren't the Republican'ts already running Zombie Ray-Gun for pResident in 2008?

Oh, wait - it's just McClueless and the Anything-But-Stright-Talk Express. Never mind...

phreedm

R4D...I gave you alot more credit. Do you want to actually allow "a brilliant campaigner" run America in this day and age? Or do you prefer experience...?

Well that's certainly a legitimate question, but I'm not so sure experience is everything. I can cite many examples of current and past politicians who've had as much real-world experience as one could possibly have before gaining power and they ended up being total disasters.

And I sure as hell don't see Obama as some sort of 'messiah'. If he does become president then he's bound to f*** up a few things. (Though, thankfully, I don't think there's any way that he or HC or JM could ever screw things up as much as the current administration.) But don't underestimate a candidate's ability to inspire. That's exactly how good leaders get shit done - by inspiring people to act. I can understand how that scares you because you don't agree with his politics. Well I do, for the most part, and based on the way he's run this campaign I've become quite convinced he can win.

Have you ever wondered if all of you Bush supporters are being played?

Debbie

If only we could be lucky enough to have Reagan back in the White House.

Have you been paying attention, Deb. We are in the midst of an economic meltdown due to deregulation and unregulation of the banking industry courtesy of Reagan. Get a grip girl!

McCain's experience is clear. He was a champion of deregulation. He was in the pockets of corrupt bankers in the 90's as one of Keating Five and in the 00's as the Paxson One. Just what we need in this deregulation-spawned economic disaster, eh folks?

Experience is a teacher if you are a student. McCain has made clear what kind of student of history he is. On Meet The Press he was asked “if you knew then, what you know now--no weapons of mass destruction-- would you have invaded a country that had nothing to do with 9/ll?”. McCain answered “yes.” Sorry, you flunked dufus!

I second the motion to dig up Ronald Reagan's rotting carcass and let it fill in for the remainder of Bush's term. It would surely be an improvement. It would also be an improvement over the time the addle-brained old fool spent in the White House while he was alive.

The Obama is muslim attack is the same kind of cheap trick that he used against Hillary in the primary. Everyone knows that Hillary is an ambitious manipulating dragon. Why do we know this? Because the Weekly Standard wrote the story years ago. Obama supporters were all too happy to chime in when those attacks started. Now that he's the front runner, the tables have turned. The sad thing is that in politics a simple ridiculous message repeated ad nauseam works more times than not. It's not us that will believe Obama is a dangerous terrorist but someone will.

If Obama is a smoker, it tells me that he either lacks intelligence or will-power, neither of which I consider desirable attributes for a president.

Debbie,just relax,read the above comments(disregard phreedy),and let the wisdom just trickle down,ok,girlfriend?okay....nice and easy........alright.......

TTSU-
Sorry, but your analysis of smoking is dead wrong. My Dad was a smoker, knew it was bad for him, but he was flat out one of the most intelligent people I have ever known. The guy held two masters and his Juris Doctor. Finished first in his class on the Bar exam, but never practiced. Decided to go back and get his degree in Architecture. Built his own business and became very successful. All while being a smoker.
He just happened to have that one vice that he couldn't get rid of.

I couldn't give a rat's ass if he smokes or not. I only care if he can help steer this country back in the right direction. Although, I'm afraid that the Idiot-in-Chief has done irreparable damage to this country.

Comment from: rainbows4dinosaurs

That's exactly how good leaders get shit done - by inspiring people to act.

So very true. So, exactly WHAT is Obama going to inspire people to do?

I can understand how that scares you because you don't agree with his politics.

You bet it does. He's a Socia1ist. Period. He doesn't understand foreign policy. Bomb Pakistan? Or how about at the last debate?

Of late, Obama has sung a decidedly noninterventionist tune. But it wasn't always so. The senator sounded quite hawkish just a few years ago in 2005,when he urged military intervention in the Darfur conflict.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/02/interventionism_obamastyle.html

Well I do, for the most part, and based on the way he's run this campaign I've become quite convinced he can win.

Most likely because you live on the "left" coast. Can you say McGovern?

Several things are happening here.

1- The press is getting rid of the Clinton's once and for all.

2- They are making sure that the dem nominee will be so far left that middle America won't vote.

3- Repaying McCain for campaign finance reform which gave them much greater power.

The only thing the Time's hit piece did a few weeks ago was to rally the conservative base.

YES. We are all being played....

R4D...tell me, why do you want to turn Health Care into a similar experience as going to the Department of Motor Vehicles?

And another Myth is proven false.

Funds raised for each campaign for the month of February...

McCain- $12 million

Clinton- $37 million

Obama- $50 million

All while gas is approaching 4 bucks a gallon and there are a record number of foreclosures.

Amazing...

phreedm,

How exactly are Obama raising $50 million in February and Gas reaching nearly $4/gal related?

Remember the claims by the Bush Administration about the Iraq war paying for itself with increased oil revenue and cheap gas for all? Why no outrage over that? Oh the hypocricy of it all!

How exactly are Obama raising $50 million in February and Gas reaching nearly $4/gal related?

Really? Come now Ren, haven't you been listening to the "messiah's" energy plans?

No..actually,

It's the myth that has been shattered. The Dems are the party of the little people. How can the little people. Those who are paying $4 a gallon for gas, or having their homes foreclosed on can still scrape money together to send to the "messiah".

And yet the wealthy Repubs can only muster up $12 million...

Rather simple connection actually...

Remember the claims by the Bush Administration about the Iraq war paying for itself with increased oil revenue and cheap gas for all? Why no outrage over that?

No doubt overly optimistic, but then again, did you really believe it? Or did you believe Pelosi making the same claims if the Dems won in 2006.

(You know, the economy was humming along in the fall of 2006. See what happens when you have a congress more interested in hearings then accomplishments?)

No, my outrage is over the morons who have prevented us from increasing oil productions here at home...

There is little to no chance of discovering any significant new onshore oil fields in the U.S.

http://maps.unomaha.edu/Peterson/funda/Sidebar/OilConsumption.html

And yet the wealthy Repubs can only muster up $12 million...

The gig is up. Americans are sick and tired of the repugnican party, that is the reason they cannot raise money.

The Democraps are raising money less than a $100 at a time from the little people (munchkins?) There are just so many of them that it adds up to millions and millions of dollars for Obama and Clinton.

Small donations add up for Obama.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/02/20/america/20obama.php


Face it. You are going to have to adjust to the idea of living under a Democraptic presidency the same way those of us that oppose Shrubco have had to suffer under the neocons over the past eight years. Bush has done more damage to the Repugnican party than any Democrap could hope to do in a hundred years.

You should be feeling ecstatic! After all, hasn't your entire life been devoted to the second coming of the messiah? Look out... here he comes. Let's all say it together, shall we? President Obama. I know you can say it.

Ohhhhhhhh, it's a beautiful day in the neighborhood, it's a beautiful day to be neighbors... would you be mine? Could you be mine? I knew you could.

obama,clinton,mccain lord mithras protect us from these 3 evil gnomes give victory to the forces of light over the forces of darkness.

reason,
So I take it you are voting for Nader?

Phreedm
i have to agree with Ren, Bush has setback the country the republican party and we who call ourselves conservatives.we need to help Ron Paul restore what it means to be a conservative.lets get back to being about strict reading of the constitution,balanced budgets,trade not endless war.we now face 4 yrs of liberal be it obama,clinton or mccain.

Ren
Nader should be locked up for being a pest.

reason,

No argument here.

how come the women on that muslim marriage service aren't dressed like i dream of jeanie?

reason,
Because Barbara Eden wasn't into tablecolths with eye-holes.

"It's the myth that has been shattered. The Dems are the party of the little people. How can the little people. Those who are paying $4 a gallon for gas, or having their homes foreclosed on can still scrape money together to send to the "messiah"."

He phinally makes a lot of sense.
One can only respond you can I if that were the case. People who are working, those that do that they are.

Ren, Ren, Ren...

You exemplify what's dangerous about Obama...

His slick words make you emotional and not rational..

When you read your article, did you do the math? It doesn't add up...


Second...

Can you give me 3 concrete policies that Obama wants to implement with his "change"? Not just pie in the sky words, but actual policies laid out...

Third...

Why do you want to turn health care into a similar experience as going to your local Department of Motor Vehicles?

Fourth...

Can you give me just one example of an accomplishment?

Comment from: Obeah

He phinally makes a lot of sense.
One can only respond you can I if that were the case. People who are working, those that do that they are.

Say Obbie...

I'd respond if you could please post in English...

Want to try again?

OK...again, a dilemma? Or do you not stand on your principles?

The Democratic presidential candidate told a town hall meeting Sunday in Nelsonvile, Ohio, in the state's rural southeast, that he is a devout Christian who prays to Jesus every night.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8V5ED1O0&show_article=1

After all, if you're going to be consistent...???

phreedm,

I just spent 25 minutes contesting your last post, point by point, and just before I was going to send it, it shit the bed on me. I am not going to do all that work again.

What I will say though is this: I have had socialized medicine since I was born. My father is retired Navy, I was active duty army and my wife still is, and I get treatment for free at the VA. I have never paid an insurance premium for healthcare in my entire life. If it works for the military and it works for congress, why would it not work for the entire country, if set up along the military's model? I'll tell you why. Greedy corporate interests.

It is painfully obvious that you do not care one lick about those less fortunate than yourself. You are content to live in the richest country on earth and let 50 million people go without health insurance and nobody knows how many more that are underinsured or cannot afford their deductables.

Wasn't it Jesus that said, "the quality of your faith is judged by how you treat “the least among you”? (OR) Do not as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory ...

And you call yourself a Christian? If I were you, I would get that log in your eye looked at, before you worry about the splinter in mine.

phreedm,

After all, if you're going to be consistent...???

So if I read you correctly, you would never vote for a non-Christian? How very constitutional of you. (No religious test for elected office)

I guess you would have us all sit this one out since there is no Atheist running? I'm sorry, but I am not a bigot, like yourself. To paraphrase a common theme, "Hate not the Christian, hate the Christianity."

phreedm,

You exemplify what's dangerous about Obama...

His slick words make you emotional and not rational..

I am voting for Obama because he is the lesser of the four current evils from which we have to choose. It is too important to not have another Republican in the White House for a very long time. Need I remind you that I was a registered Republican for 17 yrs, a Libertarian for less than 2 yrs, an Independant for almost 4 yrs, and a Democrat for less than two weeks, now? FYI, I will be changing back to an Independant as soon as the primary in my state is over. I only registered Democrat so I could caucus for Obama.

It is not his slick words that make me emotional. It is my illness coupled with your ignorance that makes me angry.

phreedm

He doesn't understand foreign policy. Bomb Pakistan?

You're pretty silly. I guess you missed us bombing, and killing, several key Al Qaeda leaders in northern Pakistan just last month: http://www.nationalterroralert.com/updates/2008/02/05/three-al-qaeda-leaders-killed-in-us-strike/

Northern Pakistan is where the enemy is. In all likelihood it is where Bin Laden himself is. That two-faced megalomanic Musharraf has been completely ineffectual in this fight since it began. IMO we should've had troops on the ground there from day one. But no, George Jr. had a score to settle for his daddy...

R4D...tell me, why do you want to turn Health Care into a similar experience as going to the Department of Motor Vehicles?

HA! Have you even been to the doctor lately? Or better yet, an emergency room or urgent care? Ever had to wrestle with your insurance over a claim? Been denied coverage for a crucial drug? IF ONLY getting health care was as easy as a trip to the DMV.

Besides, going to the DMV here in Portland isn't much trouble at all, especially if you go to one of the DMV expresses that keep popping up in the malls. Also, several years ago when I was trying to finish up school and my family was without insurance, we had our kids on the Oregon Health Plan and I have to tell you it was by far the very best health care we've ever received. So really your analogy falls flat with me.

Maybe you've had a different experience back in old Big Lick (wouldn't surprise me.) Could it be that you folks could learn a thing or two about how to run a society from us here on the 'left coast?'

Why bother with Phreeky? The schmuck still buys the whole Al Qaeda in Iraq story. Wouldn't he be shocked to find out that there is no such group that calls itself Al Qaeda in Iraq. There is however a small and feckless handful of agitators that call themselves the Islamic State of Iraq and that somehow have been labeled by BushCo and our falling-down-on-the-job MSM as Al Qaeda in Iraq. I guess Phreeky thinks that it is a legitimate use of our government to direct propaganda at its own people.

Comment from: phreedm [Member]

So very true. So, exactly WHAT is Obama going to inspire people to do?

It seems that he is already inspriring those who claim to be christian into hypocritically lying about him...

You bet it does. He's a Socia1ist. Period. He doesn't understand foreign policy. Bomb Pakistan? Or how about at the last debate?

Just sing a few choruses of "bomb iran", and you'll be getting close to the foreign policy understanding of the Republican't still standing. Funny how you don't seem to notice the lack of foreign policy understanding that McClueless is demonstrating...

Comment from: phreedm [Member]

Ren, Ren, Ren...

You exemplify what's dangerous about Obama...

While you merely illustrate what's dangerously irrational about christianity and radical christians.

His slick words make you emotional and not rational..

...as opposed to the slick words of your basic evangelical cult leader making phreakshows spew emotional irrational occult kimchee on an atheist web site.

Can you give me 3 concrete policies that Obama wants to implement with his "change"? Not just pie in the sky words, but actual policies laid out...

Can you give anyone any reason why they should respond with any sort of answer to someone who cannot answer any questions put to him, yet feels he is intitled to grill everyone else about anything?

Why do you want to turn health care into a similar experience as going to your local Department of Motor Vehicles?

Why do you consider it okay to make baldfaced lies such as this? do you have any proof of your irrational, illogical statement that health care will be similar to interacting with the DMV?

By the way, and for the record, the DMV has turned itself around here in Michigan. It is considerably easier to deal with than sanctimonious sermons from lying christian hypocrites these days.

What,

Why bother with Phreeky?

I can only speak for myself, but I believe it has something to do with my illness.

I have the same problem when I go out in public, which is why I don't venture out much. It is going to get me arrested, one of these days.

The fact is: I just can't sit silent when I hear someone say something patently stupid. So I confront them. I realize it is not rational and I also realize that the likelihood of me changing phreedm's mind is probably less than nil. Even if I did, I know he would never admit it.

So please everyone, forgive me for feeding the troll. Maybe you can pass around the virtual hat and purchase me a set of blinders for "Christ on a stick" day. Thanks.

I have a Lab, it's fun to hang out and hike with the dog, people come up to him, and pet him, it's fun.
George Eads

This discussion is fascinating and eye opening. One can justify everything if they want to...

Comment from: Ren [Member]

What I will say though is this: I have had socialized medicine since I was born. My father is retired Navy, I was active duty army and my wife still is, and I get treatment for free at the VA. I have never paid an insurance premium for healthcare in my entire life.

Free? Yikes...NOTHING is free...

If it works for the military and it works for congress, why would it not work for the entire country, if set up along the military's model?

First of all it's not free. Second, it doesn't work. "Walter Reed"?

I'll tell you why. Greedy corporate interests.

Now that's a revealing statement. I'll tell you what, I'd much rather deal with someone who has to perform to get paid instead of dealing with a government employee who has zero accountability...

You know, I've heard everyone on this board claim the RR is shredding the Constitution and stealing your rights.

Why oh why are you so willing to give up your freedoms to the Government?

By the way...I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a single accomplishment of Obama's...

Now that's a revealing statement. I'll tell you what, I'd much rather deal with someone who has to perform to get paid instead of dealing with a government employee who has zero accountability...

the only accountability insurance companies have now is to their pocketbooks. my father works in the insurance industry (claims adjuster) and my mother in the medical industry (nurse) so I've heard some stories. medical establishments will inflate their fees with unnecesary tests and procedures because insurance will pay, and then insurance companies will take the slightest discrepency in your medical record as reason to deny you coverage, leaving unsuspecting patrons to foot the bill. the only kinds of insurance that provide any protection from this bait and switch are insurance plans that are obligated to cover you, either because you're covered under a company plan or a government plan.

I would much rather be in the hands of a government employee who's pay does not depend on finding any possible excuse to give me the least protection possible.

the thing about insurance is that you've paid them before they're expected to perform. once you've laid down your premiums for a few years they have nothing to lose and everything to gain by leaving you hanging in the wind.

playdumb,

Free? Yikes...NOTHING is free...

Please show me where I said it was free. All I said was that I have never paid an insurance premium. I paid for my healthcare through my service to my country.

The difference between a military hospital and a civilian hospital, is that the military hospital is there to serve their constituents, and a civilian hospital exists to make a profit for their shareholders.

So I suppose you support the police and fire departments existing to make a profit? I say do away with them and let the free market work it out on how to protect us. While we are at it, let's just do away with the socialized military and let the free market take care of our protection. Oh wait... never mind. Blackwater is already doing a good job of that... for a much fucking higher cost, I might add.

First of all it's not free. Second, it doesn't work. "Walter Reed"?

First of all, stop misrepresenting my position, dumbass. Second, "Walter Reed" occured as a result of a Republican administration, not a democratic one, so it is the fault of those like yourself, that thought the war in Iraq was a good idea, and neglected to take care of the wounded that you never expected to have. Sorry, but you can't blame that on Clinton.

Now that's a revealing statement. I'll tell you what, I'd much rather deal with someone who has to perform to get paid instead of dealing with a government employee who has zero accountability...

So you are saying that military doctors are not accountable to anyone? I would love to know the amount of cognitive dissonance required to come up with that gem. Please, oh wise sage... care to provide a link to back up that statement? I didn't think so.

Why oh why are you so willing to give up your freedoms to the Government?

Instead of making bold, meaningless, blanket statements, please go into great detail on how having a single payer healthcare system, that would decrease costs by doing away with so many levels of redundancy in the beurocracy, equals giving up our freedoms to the government. You are already giving up your freedom to an HMO, or Health insurance company and paying a premium to do it.

Now imagine that the majority of people that get their healthcare through their employers, no longer got it through their employer. The first thing they would get is a pay raise, because the company no longer has to pay for their insurance. Now imagine that pay raise went to higher taxes to cover health insurance. If your company used their size to bargain for lower healthcare costs, imagine how much of a discount a company that is 300,000,000 large could get.

By the way...I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a single accomplishment of Obama's...

He's the first black man to virtually have a lock on a major party's nomination for president of the United States. That's a hell of a lot more than YOU have done with YOUR life.

Do us all a favor, preedm and go choke yourself. I hear the religious are into auto-erotica and that sort of thing, anyhow.

See, I can make blanket statements that are unsupported by facts, too.

That “war thingie” is being conducted against Islamic Extremists which is why people are so interested in BHO's belief system. The fact that the question is being asked is relevant in the minds of many people. The fact that BHO has not come out in front of the media to state that he is not Muslim, and has no ties to Muslim interests is fuel being added to this fire. A simple statement by him would take the fuel away and it would die as an issue.

True there would be people who wouldn't believe him no matter what he says but in the minds of most, a direct statement by him would be enough. The fact that he will not make this kind of public statement would seem to indicate that he has something to hide, that he holds the American Public in Contempt, or that he is just plain out of touch with the people he hopes to lead. Even if he feels he shouldn’t have to make these statements, he should just do it to let the issue rest.

Ken345aa,

The fact that BHO has not come out in front of the media to state that he is not Muslim, and has no ties to Muslim interests is fuel being added to this fire. A simple statement by him would take the fuel away and it would die as an issue.

What alternative universe are you inhabiting? Obama has stated numerous times that he is a Christian, has attended the same church for 20 years, and that he prays to Jesus (every night!). WTF else is he supposed to do?

It's disgusting that candidates have to waste their time on this sort of nonsense in order to get elected. Personally, I find it discouraging that all of the presidential candidates have imaginary friends, but wouldn't it be refreshing if they could all just keep that information to themselves? It's idiots like you that make that impossible.

Tarma,

Thank you for saving me the effort. I was going to ask what F'ing Rock he was hiding under, but other than that, our responses could have been verbatim.

Tarma, The simple words "I am not a Muslim, and I have never been a Muslim." or "I am not a Muslim and have no ties to Muslim interests." would also work.

This is not for me but for the people that it is an issue to.

A way you might understand is this. Saying "I am an Atheist." is not the same as saying "I have never been Christian." or some other religion of choice. It gives a sense of history and shows where a persons belief system came from. People just want to hear him say it on the record in public and then it's end of story. It would take all of 20 seconds or perhaps more if he feels the need to qualify it.

It's kind of like Clinton denying the blow jobs he got in the oval office for so long and then he had to suck it in and admit they happened. If he had just admitted to it and told the country that it was a matter between him and Hillary that was already resolved it wouldn't have turned into a national issue.

By the way it's idiots like you that make assumptions about other people that are the real problem. I have no interest in Obama so his beliefs or history are totally irrelevant to me. I do hate it when a public person like a candidate won't just address an issue presented to them and answer it instead of letting it turn into propaganda.

I don't believe in any of the people running for President right now. We are about to enter into another election with nothing but bad choices.

Ken345aa

The simple words "I am not a Muslim, and I have never been a Muslim." or "I am not a Muslim and have no ties to Muslim interests." would also work.

Um... he says this very thing all the time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7INpMhtG3g

Now who's the idiot? :)

Ken,

You should probably watch this video before continuing to assume that Obama has not confronted these accusations directly:
http://tinyurl.com/ytt5jw

Quite simply, you're wrong.

Ken345aa,

Try reading the statement that started the topic. Apparently you are an idiot.

Too bad you are a typical christian that loves to hate anyone that is not on the white jee-bus.

Ken,

I have no interest in Obama so his beliefs or history are totally irrelevant to me.

For someone who has no interest in BHO, you sure seem to spend a lot of time blathering on about him.

Tell me Ken, which bothers you more? That he is black, or that he might be a closet Muslim? Because both are forbidden by the Constitution as reasons to disqualify BHO from the White House. So are you a racist, or a Bigot? 'Cause you sure are not a patriotic American, since you are opposed to the Constitution.

First of all I am glad that BHO has made on the record statements. I personally had not seen them before because it is not something I am interested in or have followed. Perhaps it will mark the start of this issue dissappearing.

I was only interested in pointing out why it was in issue in so many peoples eyes. I was responding to the end of the original post on this blog that mentioned the "War Thingie" and how it could have an impact in people wanting to know.

Me mentioning that Tarma was an idiot by assuming things about me was only brought on by him/her calling me an idiot as part of his/her assumption about me.

Rainbows4dinosaurs, thanks for providing the link to the video. It should provide exactly what people want to hear from BHO. Perhaps now the Witch Hunt can end.

Alatham, normally he only states that he is Christian as he does in the clip on his web site. For the people that wanted to hear his denial of Islam that was not enough.

Rna2dna, I did read that statement, and the quoted text from a transcript from a private meeting does not exactly make it a public statement on the record the way the video provided by Rainbows4dinosaurs, link does. I don't deny that it has been a witch hunt of sorts I was only pointing out that if he came out on the record he could end it. Apparently he has done just that and people should have no reasons to continue their behavior spreading rumors.

Of course you have to also add your similar dig about me being a Christian in much the same way these people have accused him of being Muslim. You know absolutely nothing about my belief system or what if any religion or faith system I have or believe in. You are just making the same kind of assumption that Tarma made about me. What does that say about you?

I came on here only to post a point of view and shed some light on the motive certain people have for some of the things they have done regarding the rumors about BHO's beliefs. I don't support spreading rumors but I can understand why people might feel distress about things they have heard or read concerning his history and his loyalties. This was only and continues to be an effort on my part to help people reading this understand why people have been feeling nervous about BHO. Hopfully I have helped people in understanding that point of view. BHO himself has made the statements they were wanting to hear so the only people left stirring the pot are those with some other agenda.

Ren, I don't like any of the current crop of Presidential contenders and it has nothing to do with race, religion, gender or sex. I don't like any of them for some of the positions they are running on, and because I don't think any of them would be any better than Bush. What a world we live in.

Thank you for also making assumptions about me. It seems to be a recurring theme here.

Ken345aa,

What ticked me off is that you are perpetuating the rumors about Obama being a Muslim just as much as anyone.

Your saying that Obama needs to make a statement said to me that you were willfully ignorant of the man's oft-repeated and widely publicized pronouncements that he is a Christian and that he is not a Muslim.

He's said it! Repeatedly! Enough!! If people choose to not believe him, that is their problem, not his.

Nothing makes me think he is "hiding something," "holding the American public in contempt," or "plain out of touch." Gimme a break.

Comment from: phreedm [Member]

By the way...I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a single accomplishment of Obama's...

By the way, we're just waiting for you to answer any of the multitude of questions you've been asked. Funny how you seem to ignore that - while still demanding answers from others.

Remind anyone else of any drunken cokeheaded deserters currently serving as the Worst pResident Ever?

Tarma, I'm sorry you felt that I was perpetuating rumors, but I was only trying to point out what it was that people were looking for from BHO. The fact that he actually made the specific public statements that the doubters were looking for shows that he has nothing to hide is in touch and does not feel contempt towards the public. I hope that now perhaps this campaign they have been on will end.

I suspect that those with an agenda will never believe what he says and that is a sad window on the state of political discourse in this country. People have been lied to by so many people in power for so long that many people don't believe anything a polititian says or does.

If we could only get a Statesman for President and both houses of Congress full of Statesmen instead of polititions we could perhaps be a great country again.

Oh and I don't actually think you are an idiot since I don't know you. It just fit in as a retort to your first post aimed at me. No hard feelings I hope.

Ken345aa,

Sorry, I don't actually think you are an idiot either. Peace?

I suspect that those with an agenda will never believe what he says and that is a sad window on the state of political discourse in this country. People have been lied to by so many people in power for so long that many people don't believe anything a polititian says or does.

If we could only get a Statesman for President and both houses of Congress full of Statesmen instead of polititions we could perhaps be a great country again.

I agree 100 percent. And Obama is the only one who sounds even remotely like a statesman to me.

Ken,

Once again, I spent 15 minutes responding to your last post directed at me, but it disappeared before I got a chance to post it.

Has that been happening to anyone else, or is it my computer?

Suffice to say, would it really be so bad to have a Muslim for president? There has never been an openly Atheist president, so I really don't care what version of the myth a presidential candidate believes, so long as they are intelligent and otherwise qualified to fill the position. A pet rock would be better than what we have now. Besides, it's not like he is going to get elected president and purposely allow Al Qaeda to sneek in and kill us all. That's just plain silly. No, it's paranoia.

For the record, I do not like any of the current crop of candidates, either. If there were no differences between Obama and McCain, I would gladly vote Libertarian, just like I did in the last two general elections. But there are huge differences and we cannot afford another Republican in the White House, anytime soon.

As far as making assumptions about you, I can only make inferencs about you by what you post, since I do not know you, and you have no history here for me to draw from. My apologies if I misinterpreted you. But you can still lick my balls if I had you pegged correctly. Your choice.

Ken,
I don't want to continue to make assumptions about you, so instead I will ask you directly when I don't understand something.

So here goes. (tongue firmly in cheek) Does the 345aa in your moniker stand for the 3:45 Alcoholics Anonymous meetings you attend?

No, seriously. I am sure there are not 345 other registered Kens on this blog and you needed the 'aa' to differentiate yourself from them. It must mean something.

If you don't mind me asking: is there any meaning behind the name? I don't mean any disrespect, but without you telling me what it is, I am left with only my assumptions about you.

I will gladly explain the meaning behind my name, if you didn't catch it recently in a previous thread.

Ren, Sorry for your computer problems. Many years ago I had a similar problem and it turned out to be a trojan on my computer and someone was trying to be funny. Might I suggest that you could formulate your reply as a document and then just cut and paste it here so you won't loose anything. Apologies accepted and I'm sorry if it seemed like I was just dropping in and trying to be a troublemaker.

I personally don't care about the religous beliefs or non beliefs of our elected officials as long as they do the job. The main problem I have is them not doing the job and it has nothing to do with religous beliefs. For instance, as currently elected officials, how much work have we gotten out of our Presidential hopefulls since they decided to run for President? Yet they still draw a full paycheck and benefits. My problems with the current system are way to extensive to go into here, so I won't.

Thank you for the suggestion. It has happened about 5 times now in the past week. Very annoying and always after putting much time and effort into it. Never when I first start to compose. I may very well take your advice if it continues to happen.

I think if we sat down over a beer, we would find we have a lot in common re: out current crop of louts in all three, no make that four, branches of government.

As to my last post. I really hope I didn't come off as an ass. I tried to ask an honest question and infuse it with a little humor. Again, no disrespect intended.

Comment from: Ren [

Please show me where I said it was free

OK...

I have had socialized medicine since I was born. My father is retired Navy, I was active duty army and my wife still is, and I get treatment for free at the VA.

But I'll accept the fact that you don't believe socia1ized medicine is free...that being understood you then don't have a problem with asking your neighbor to cover your medical bills...I do.

And why make this a Republican, Democrat issue? It's "free market" vs "government control"...

You believe the government can do it better...I don't.

So you are saying that military doctors are not accountable to anyone? I would love to know the amount of cognitive dissonance required to come up with that gem. Please, oh wise sage... care to provide a link to back up that statement? I didn't think so

Why can't you connect the dots? Are you that blind?

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/moneymag/moneymag_archive/1994/10/01/89168/index.htm

Instead of making bold, meaningless, blanket statements, please go into great detail on how having a single payer healthcare system, that would decrease costs by doing away with so many levels of redundancy in the beurocracy, equals giving up our freedoms to the government. You are already giving up your freedom to an HMO, or Health insurance company and paying a premium to do it.

Name ONE Government program that has actually reduced cost...

I am FREE on deciding which HMO I want to belong to. Hilary's plan would be similar to Massachusetts. Obama says his isn't, but every economist that has studied it states it would only be a matter of time before it would be forced upon all in an attempt to make it work.

And costs are still an issue:

Massachusetts now estimates that its spending on the new program for the uninsured may exceed its budget by nearly $150 million.
The penalty for not complying with the mandate is steep. Individuals who don't get insurance this year -- or don't get an exemption -- will face a fine of $912, four times last year's penalty and scheduled to increase each year.
The state "negotiated" with the health insurers participating in the Commonwealth Connector to keep premium increases to about 5% this year. But the insurers said in order to keep their prices down, they warned they have to increase copayments and/or deductibles and/or cut benefits. Many newly-insured say they have trouble finding primary care physicians who will see them.
And to show how hard it will be to get to a point that everyone will be able to get "coverage as good as members of Congress have," in Massachusetts, a gold-plated Blue Cross Blue Shield plan in the Connector would cost a family of four about $23,000 a year.

http://www.galen.org/component,8/action,show_content/id,14/category_id,0/blog_id,1028/type,33/


Ren, you've bought into the lie hook, line and sinker. The only thing a politician is interested in is power. Granting them control over our decisions on health increases their power and takes freedoms from all of us. If you can't see that then there is no way I'll ever make it clear on an Internet blog...

phreedm,

I have had socialized medicine since I was born. My father is retired Navy, I was active duty army and my wife still is, and I get treatment for free at the VA.

Once again you have misrepresented my position. I noticed you quoted the portion where I said I get healthcare for free at the VA. As in, it doesn't cost me anything out of my pocket to go there. You conveniently left out the part where I said I paid for that healthcare in advance through my military service.

I guess you support sending America's youth off to senseless wars, only to throw them to the lions when they return with their health ruined.

I have been covered by socialized medicine my whole life, and I haven't a single complaint about it. When was the last time YOU had socialized medicine? That's right, never. And yet, I know nothing of which I speak, while you are the expert on the subject.

And you wonder why I have such contempt for you? You make it sound like I am a two year old and I just don't understand that you can't get something for nothing. We already pay more per capita for healthcare than any other industrialized nation on the planet, and yet have 50 million uninsured and millions more underinsured.

In all honesty, with everything you know about Jesus Christ, would he support a free market healthcare solution that leaves millions of people uninsured, or would he support a single payer system where everyone is covered? Don't dodge the question, either. I want to see you put it in writing that Jesus is as big a dick as you are.

phreedm,

One more thing and then I am done with you.

But I'll accept the fact that you don't believe socia1ized medicine is free...that being understood you then don't have a problem with asking your neighbor to cover your medical bills...I do.

That's funny. My neigbor had no problem sitting on his ass in the safety of his home while my wife and I went off to war to protect his right to sit on his ass. I think it is time my NEIGHBOR paid HIS DUES. My family has already paid theirs.

Oh yeah. I forgot. Soldiers are to be used and then thrown away. Way to support the troops, asshole!

Don't ever address me again. You are not worthy of my attention.

Anyone else notice the mental disconnect involved in someone who has swallowed religious insanity whole saying that others have bought the lie hook, line, and sinker?

Suck it, Jeebus feti$hist.

phreedm was in the Army...? Holy cow... I thought they had standards... Although I guess with enough time anybody can be trained to clean a latrine...

Rusty
Where are you getting that phreedm was in the Army? You sure you're not confusing him with Ren, because he used a quote from Ren in his 03/04/08 @ 19:07 post?

Thanks Karen, you're right. Whew! It's scary to think of 4-F Phreedy with a gun in his hands.