NoGodBlog.com

He also reminded the prelates that religion cannot only be considered a "private matter" without any bearing on public behavior.

The poop thinks that The Wall should have a one way tunnel through it.

Well, I would like to blame Jesus, the pope, and the caholic church for sex crimes against children. I would like to blame Islam for believing in virgins, and Judaism for believing in circumcisions. Furthermore, I'd like to blame buddhism for believing in gasoline induced spontaneous combustion, and hinduism for believing in social castes. I would like to blame scientology for believing in alien hybrids, and mormonism for believing in polygomy. There!

Wow...does anyone doubt Dave's hatred towards the Catholic church? It's dripping from the corners of his mouth...

Dave...your words would carry a bit more weight if you were equally as outraged over the rapes taking place within our public schools...

Or how about the rapes taking place in 3rd world nations by UN Peace Keepers...

I can only imagine how Dave's innocent daughter is being forced to listen to his hatred of the Catholic church over the dinner table...

BTW...Virginia Tech had another "state sponsored" vigil yesterday. Prayers included...

AA won't take Tech and Virginia to task until we have a Republican Govenor...

Think I'm dreaming? Another liberal wing of the Democrat Party...the NAACP protested every Labor Day at Virginia Beach when we had a Republican Govenor. Once a Democrat was elected the protests stopped....

I love consistency...

You can't get much lower than trying to cover up the rape of a child. The pope should hang his head in shame and we should have never invited him. Truly disgusting.

I bet the child rapes in public schools would get more attention if there was a world-wide network of rapist teachers who were shuttled from school to school in an effort to hide them every time an allegation was made and quietly swept under the rug. It would also help if the ring-leader "principal" was a head-of-state.

Your comparison is obviously flawed. When a public school teacher is caught abusing children, he is prosecuted and sent to prison where he occupies the bottom of the inmate hierarchy. When a catholic priest is caught, he is quietly moved to a new parish where he is rewarded with a fresh batch of potential victims.

Comment from: TIMx13

Your comparison is obviously flawed. When a public school teacher is caught abusing children, he is prosecuted and sent to prison where he occupies the bottom of the inmate hierarchy.

No it's not...obviously you do about as much research on one of Dave's topics as the other superior intellects who post on this blog do...

If you did you'd find the vast number of teachers ARE protected not only from the local school district but also from the NEA...

Tell me...why aren't you as offended towards the public schools as you are the Catholic church?

Kids are being raped. Period. And yet time and time again everyone on this board either ignores or defends public schools...

Exactly how are you any different then a Bishop that protected a priest?

Ah...now I know why Dave's anger is raging over the Pope's visit...the religion of atheism has been attacked...

The pope urged the United States to treat immigrants humanely, and called on Americans to spurn materialism and shun secularism.

An atheist couldn't exist without materialism and secularism...

Tell me...why aren't you as offended towards the public schools as you are the Catholic church?

phreedum,
this is an atheist blog not a public school blog so doesn't it follow that we would be interested in posting about the sex abuse rampant in the catholic church over that of the secular public school system?

The pope - what a sad anachronism he is. Guess he has to do what he can to keep that sucker money flowing into the Vatican's coffers though. Those solid gold rooms aren't cheap.

phreedm's hatred of AA shows through much stronger than anything else when he gets on these irrational rants.

i guess he thinks that AA should take on every social problem and injustice in the country. why don't you set up an organization with all the profits from one of your multi-businesses to solve all the country's ills, then setup a webblog and let us come abd knock you constantly for not including some injustice.

jesh what a bore you are.

I should have known better...

First of all, I'm just as sickened by child abuse in public schools and everywhere else it occurs, but I don't post about it in an atheist blog because it isn't related to religion.

We post about child abuse at the hands of catholic priests here because it is related to religion. It happens in churches and catholic schools and has been happening for decades. It is and has been covered up by the catholic church, and the pope is the CEO. It is relevant to post here about it.

Second, please, hit us with one single example of a teacher who was shuttled from school to school because he or she was guilty of child rape, but the district wanted to protect him? One single example of a teacher's union preventing criminal prosecution in a child rape case? I will not pretend all abuse in public schools has been handled well or that all has been done to prevent it, but the scope and scale of abuse in the church and the lengths to which the church has gone to hide it is beyond comparison.

Your comparison is invalid on every conceivable level, but you'll ignore logic and continue on with your nonsense as you always do.

Again, I should have known better.

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that when Pope Palpatine speaks, he sounds an awful lot like Dr. Strangelove?

Teachers don't preach morality.

What the hell happened to some of you in the public schools that turned you so sour? Did you get bullied and now you want to turn the tables, bullying the public schools who can't fight back against your bitter attacks?

Did you really get all that bad of an education in the public schools? Mine was decent back in the old days (the 70's). I don't have kids but I have a nephew who's graduating from HS this year and has his choice of 8 or so pretty good universities who want him next year. I have co-workers, most of them well educated and involved in their children's education, who's kids are succeeding in the public schools.

Why some people think that public schools should be immune to the ills that affect our society as a whole is beyond me. How can anybody be surprised that there is violence and drugs and abuse in schools when these same problems are found in our neighborhoods, workplaces, and yes, even private schools and churches.

If public schools have more than their share of these problems, is it really their fault? Maybe instead of blaming the NEA or incompentent teachers we should be blaming parents who expect the schools not just to teach their kids but to provide basic care and to raise them. Or blame all of us who bitch and moan about taxes constantly creating political pressure that leaves the schools perpetually underfunded and understaffed.

Don't feed the troll.

TX is right. i'm guilty as hell of this once again. as much of an easy target that our long time troll makes, i have to resist commenting. problem is unless we all resist, you still end up dragged in by reading other posts that address his comments.

isn't it pathetic that he hangs around like this? he must be driven by hate and fanaticism. a truly sick guy and hopefully my last comment about or to him.

anyway back to the topic. i don't think it is by coincidence that the pope announced that the catholicism is not the dominant religion anymore, that their hold is slipping and so he comes to the developed nation where the populace is 80% believers. a recruiting trip is all.

the catholicism [and all the others]is not materially different from scientology. just a different story and methods but similar outcome, i.e, brainwashed flock

Phreedom said:

Dave...your words would carry a bit more weight if you were equally as outraged over the rapes taking place within our public schools...

QF: Show me the statistics. I have a hunch that more kids get molested and abused by priests and nuns in catholic schools than by teachers in public schools.

Phreeky thinks that due process is protection. What an idiot. No wonder he is still a supporter of the torture loving BushCo.

Sayonara

as much of an easy target that our long time troll makes, i have to resist commenting. problem is unless we all resist, you still end up dragged in by reading other posts that address his comments.

I think the best way to handle losers like Phreeky is through ridicule. Never address him directly and simply ridicule his flaunted ignorance.

Sayonara

i guess he thinks that AA should take on every social problem and injustice in the country.

Yes that's his usual moronic shtick - AA should take on all of the problems in the world or none of them. He would prefer that we take on none of them. Matter of fact he prefers that governments as well make no efforts to take on such problems unless they are sanctioned by the church. The church is all he trusts. The lad is stuck in the dark ages.

quantum_flux,

Actually, last I checked the numbers were unreliable. Phreedm brought up this exact same topic a few weeks ago and I went looking for numbers.

Needless to say, I couldn't find any real evidence to back up Phreedm's conclusion. And Phreedm didn't attempt to supply any.

Do a text search for "Charol Shakeshaft" at this page:
http://tinyurl.com/63ddxt

This page is a good example of the kind of lies that Phreedm is willing to throw around to support his bizarre claims.

The conclusion is that abuse by educators is woefully understudied. There is no good reason to believe that teacher abuse is worse than preacher abuse at this time.

I told this to Phreedm weeks ago, but he doesn't care about facts when they interfere with his conclusions.

Please don't feed the trolls...

Is it okay if I give them a nasty taunting, and make them look like even more of a fool than they do themselves?

Comment from: phreedm

Wow...does anyone doubt Dave's hatred towards the Catholic church?

Why, yes. Yes, I do doubt it.

And not just because you've said it - even though that strongly correlates to whatever was said being a complete crock of sh!t that is almost exaclty opposite to what the truth of the matter is on whatever you're talking about.

No - I doubt it because I have seen no factual evidence to back up your unfounded, unsourced allegation. Amazingly, I have yet to see you provide any proof of anything you say here, despite being repeatedly asked by all and sundry to provide it.

It's dripping from the corners of his mouth...

...unlike that jeebus seed you've got spewing out of your vacuous pie-hole.

What's that word again? Hyp-, hypo-, christian! Yeah, that's it...

Dave...your words would carry a bit more weight if you were equally as outraged over the rapes taking place within our public schools...

...and your words might carry some weight if you even noticed that american soldiers are raping their fellow american soldiers in Iraq. Or if (as others have noted) this particular delusion had some factual evidence to back it up.

Or how about the rapes taking place in 3rd world nations by UN Peace Keepers...

...or how about rapes taking place in Gitmo by americans on people who have been held for years without any charges, and who will never get a fair trial in a court of law? Or rapes taking place in christian households by christians?

I can only imagine how Dave's innocent daughter is being forced to listen to his hatred of the Catholic church over the dinner table...

...and I can only imagine the torments you use on those poor delusional teens who are being 'taught' by you.

BTW...Virginia Tech had another "state sponsored" vigil yesterday. Prayers included...

...btw, some pastafarians dressed up like pirates the other day. And worshipped a false gawd without being crucified! The horror!

AA won't take Tech and Virginia to task until we have a Republican Govenor...

...while christians won't stop their sanctimonious hypocritical moralizing. Ever.

Think I'm dreaming?

Actually, I think you're somewhat delusional (among quite a few other things). But I'm willing to admit that I might be wrong. How about you?

Another liberal wing of the Democrat Party...the NAACP protested every Labor Day at Virginia Beach when we had a Republican Govenor. Once a Democrat was elected the protests stopped....

...another backhanded slur by a Republican't against the darkies.

Oh, and you forgot to mention Barack Hussein Obama.

I love consistency...

...which would be a good thing, since you consistently lie your a$$ off around here. As opposed to your hypocritical demands for answers from others while refusing to answer any questions yourself.

alatham,

"I told this to Phreedm weeks ago, but he doesn't care about facts when they interfere with his conclusions."

bingo!

what,

i hear ya. but it's still tough just to see/read the same diatribe and themes regurgitated by him year after year. but like i said before, this is an atheist site, not a xtian nutjob site, so i'm not going to stay away because of him.

Phreedm:

"Wow...does anyone doubt Dave's hatred towards the Catholic church? It's dripping from the corners of his mouth..."

NO, and who cares? He is the voice of an atheist group. Does he have some sort of commitment to be lovey dovey with Catholics? No. Does he have a commitment to discuss outrage over religious issues? Yes. Therefore, your next assertion:

"Dave...your words would carry a bit more weight if you were..."

Is merely: Red Herring. Ad Moinem. Tu quoque. Sorry.

The argument of 'misplaced outrage' doesn't invalidate the source. You can try to poison the well all you want by trotting out other tragedies. It doesn't make what happens in the catholic church any less loathsome.

quantum_flux,

Actually, last I checked the numbers were unreliable. Phreedm brought up this exact same topic a few weeks ago and I went looking for numbers.

Needless to say, I couldn't find any real evidence to back up Phreedm's conclusion. And Phreedm didn't attempt to supply any.

Do a text search for "Charol Shakeshaft" at this page:
http://tinyurl.com/63ddxt

This page is a good example of the kind of lies that Phreedm is willing to throw around to support his bizarre claims.

The conclusion is that abuse by educators is woefully understudied. There is no good reason to believe that teacher abuse is worse than preacher abuse at this time.

I told this to Phreedm weeks ago, but he doesn't care about facts when they interfere with his conclusions.

My hunch remains then.

Comment from: quantum_flux

QF: Show me the statistics. I have a hunch that more kids get molested and abused by priests and nuns in catholic schools than by teachers in public schools.

And exactly what difference would it make if I did...?

Comment from: alexatheist

phreedum,
this is an atheist blog not a public school blog so doesn't it follow that we would be interested in posting about the sex abuse rampant in the catholic church over that of the secular public school system?

Please Alex...topics often are thrown around that have nothing to do with atheism...

Phreeky goes off-topic as a tactic when losing the on-topic argument. This should be contrasted with going of topic because one is not interested in the present topic. What a dolt!

going of -> going off

Please Alex...topics often are thrown around that have nothing to do with atheism...

Perhaps our postings get off topic but the topics of our postings are always relgiously oriented.

Comment from: TIMx13

Your comparison is invalid on every conceivable level, but you'll ignore logic and continue on with your nonsense as you always do.

Logic...eh? How about proof?

Schools let sex abuse cases slide

Second, please, hit us with one single example of a teacher who was shuttled from school to school because he or she was guilty of child raqe, but the district wanted to protect him?

Records show that school leaders missed red flags or ignored complaints from parents, students and staff, allowing some educators to engage in years of sexual misconduct, ranging from inappropriate touching to raq


e.

The charismatic band teacher charmed students and parents alike. He won music competitions and teaching honors. He worked late, coached volleyball and mentored kids.

No one realized Joseph Billera, then 30, was having sex with children.

http://www.oregonlive.com/special/index.ssf/2008/02/schools_let_sex_abuse_cases_sl.html

In case after case the AP examined, accusations of inappropriate behavior were dismissed. One girl in Mansfield, Ohio, complained about a sexual assault by teacher Donald Coots and got expelled. It was only when a second girl, years later, brought a similar complaint against the same teacher that he was punished.

And that second girl also was ostracized by the school community and ultimately left town.

And in Hawaii, no educators were disciplined by the state in the five years the AP examined, even though some teachers there were serving sentences for various sex crimes during that time. They technically remained teachers, even behind bars.

One down....

but the scope and scale of abuse in the church and the lengths to which the church has gone to hide it is beyond comparison.

You're wrong...

One report mandated by Congress estimated that as many as 4.5 million students, out of roughly 50 million in American schools, are subject to sexual misconduct by an employee of a school sometime between kindergarten and 12th grade. That figure includes verbal harassment that's sexual in nature.

http://www.theledger.com/article/20071021/NEWS/710210485

Now that was easy...anyone could have discovered these facts for themselves...that is if they truly...just as sickened by child abuse in public schools


Give me the next excuse...

Comment from: alatham

Actually, last I checked the numbers were unreliable. Phreedm brought up this exact same topic a few weeks ago and I went looking for numbers.

Needless to say, I couldn't find any real evidence to back up Phreedm's conclusion.

Needless to say...your research skills are woefully lacking...

phreedum,
What's your point? no one in here is in favour of sexual abuse of children so why are you so obsessed with showing us how bad public school abuse is? this doesn't change the fact the world's self appointed moral authorities on all sexual matters are guilty of not just rampant sexual abuse but of covering it up. How can anyone still support the catholic church? fuck the church and fuck anyone who hasn't distanced themselves from these monsters.

Veering off topic a bit, but one does wonder why the troll, who is so hung up on sexual abuse in public schools--why he and his fellow xians who froth at the mouth over marriage being for one man and one woman--why all the good xians haven't been up in arms over the FLDS thing? Like one man and 22 wives?!! Wow, that doesn't exactly fit the one man, one woman thing does it? But I hear no outrage from the troll regarding these folks and their abuse of children.

Hard to figure trolls out, I'd say.

Phreedm -

You're obviously living in the wrong place in the country.

I'm an educator, and know of instances of teachers being sexually involved with their students. They get removed from their positions and their teaching license revoked. They are not allowed back into the profession.

I have a friend who is an excellent educator. A student made an accusation, and the response by the administration was to fire the teacher. It was later discovered that the student was mentally unbalanced and the accusation was completely unfounded. My friend was lucky - he was reinstated. More often, careers are ruined.

The Catholic Church, on the other hand, pulls their offending priest out of a particular parish, and simply put him in another one. Glosses over the problem, doesn't solve it. And until now, members of the church don't demand an accounting from their leaders, and specifically da Pope...

And he has the nerve to come here, after having moved priests and trying to cover up the problem and express concern that the problem is so prevalent here. He is really upset that everybody knows about it. The cover-up didn't work.

But, of course, this is the Catholic Church's problem. I'm sorry for the victims, but they'd be better off leaving the church and shaking the dust off their shoes. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

Phreeky doesn't like due process. He prefers church edicts, torture and the like.

From Phreeky's link (i.e. what he didn'tpost):

A total of 2,570 educators nationwide were punished for sexual misconduct from 2001-05, representing about a quarter of all educator misconduct cases in that time period.

The total number of times an action was taken against a teacher's license for sexual misconduct was 2,625 (more than 50 teachers lost licenses in more than one state). Licenses were revoked in 1,636 of the cases, surrendered in 440 cases, suspended in 376 cases and denied in 108 cases. Other punishments were handed out in the remainder of the cases.

Students were clearly identified as victims in at least 1,467 of the sexual misconduct cases. The victim was a young person - a category including students, unidentified youths, family members and neighbors - in at least 1,801 of the cases.

Educators made physical contact in at least 1,297, or 72 percent, of the cases in which the victims were youths.The remainder were cases that did not involve physical contact, including verbal sexual harassment and other offenses.

There were criminal convictions in at least 1,390, or 53 percent, of the cases.

So, to recap: Of the 1467 students affected over a five-year period (during which there was an average public school enrollment just shy of 50,000,000) no more than 1297 were touched or worse.

But wait ... at least 1390 teachers were convicted in court and over 2200 had their licenses revoked, surrendered or denied (and another 376 suspended). In other words, more than the number of kids who were touched. One can safely infer that the overwhelming majority of cases involving touching resulted in both conviction and loss of license.

These numbers are powerful evidence for the proposition that at least when the public school system knows about a problem, concrete action is taken to deal with it--both internally and in cooperation with the justice system.

That's what distinguishes the the public school system's response to this social problem from the immorality of your sleazy, let's-make-a-deal, hush-it-up, no-one-needs-to-know Catholic church.

Now STFU up you damn hypocrite!

(I'm new here and that should be good for one swift kick at the troll, right?)

ZekeCDN,
real good work,I'm glad people have the energy to go after him,but I fear he will pretend it never happened and go on his merry way pretending the damn commie Atheists are the center of all evil.

I understand septos ... it's the way of the troll. Sometimes you just can't resist giving them a whack though, even when you know it won't do any good :-)

Phreedm,

Thanks for the horrible misquote, I really appreciate that.

My original comment:

Needless to say, I couldn't find any real evidence to back up Phreedm's conclusion. And Phreedm didn't attempt to supply any.

You made the claim, it's up to your prove it. Why are you so dishonest? Why can't you prove your claim?

Those links you provided have a few stories about individuals but then go on to make more general comments that completely destroy your theory. Do you even read your own links?

Here's another good quote from the second link you provided:

Between 1997 and 2007, 767 cases of misconduct involving Oregon educators ranged from minor infractions to criminal behavior. Although those who sexually exploit students are a tiny fraction of the 35,000 educators who teach, mentor and coach in Oregon public schools, sexual misconduct with a child ranked as the most common reason the state disciplined an educator.

Nobody is denying that individual cases are sometimes handled in a disgusting manner. But you are making the claim that abuse from teachers is much more prevalent than abuse from preachers. You have not proven your claim.

That you lash out at me when I point this out speaks volumes about the weakness of your position.

ZekeCDN, good work shoving Phreedm's own link back in his face. Sadly he's so entrenched in his irrational world-view that it won't make a difference. He just wants to waste our time so we can't talk about religion. My evidence for this claim is his insistence on bringing up irrelevant topics and his constant failure to answer questions honestly.

right on david.the pope is worried because american catholics are a big source of money.also victims in america have sued an won.one can only imagine what these monsters are getting away with in the third world.
the pope is scum, never was there a more honest statement.

Looks like 4-F freedy's bizarre fiction has been smacked down by the facts... again...

Better luck next time 4-F...

Ha ha ha...

Here is a nice link from a non-US source about the current Poop's involvement:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,548238,00.html

Truly sickening. To spend millions on defending child rapists in court and then to claim you have superior morality. The whole thing makes me want to throw up.

I've heard that studies show that, on average, a child has to report abuse 7 times before someone will listen to them.

if I recall correctly, women have to alledge abuse about the same number of times before anyone will take action.

its a problem that is expressed in every facet of society, and I would make no attempt to excuse those people who dismiss allegations of abuse without inquirey. but the fact that abuse happens elsewhere does not excuse the way the catholic church has dealt with it within their own walls. The catholic church should support their clergy up to the point where they are found guilty of abuse and no further. furthermore, they should not impede the process of law.

Comment from: ZekeCDN...

Try sticking with the original questions...

I was simply asked to provide evidence of cover up by school administrators...

Typical response on this board...when a questions is answered...move the target...

But at least you do admit kids are being raped in public schools AND that there has been cover up...

That's a huge admission on this board...

Comment from: atheistmike

I'm an educator, and know of instances of teachers being sexually involved with their students.

So...another claim. Similar to Agustine and Seeker? Time will tell...

OK...for argument sake I'll take you at your word. But as an educator I'm surprised you can't follow the discussion...

Comment from: alatham

Thanks for the horrible misquote, I really appreciate that.

Not a misquote at all...you claimed to have searched and couldn't find any facts to refute my claims...

My original comment:

Needless to say, I couldn't find any real evidence to back up Phreedm's conclusion. And Phreedm didn't attempt to supply any.

You made the claim, it's up to your prove it. Why are you so dishonest? Why can't you prove your claim?

Wow...can I use that logic with claims that you have made on here?

Those links you provided have a few stories about individuals but then go on to make more general comments that completely destroy your theory.

A few? You're so arrogant and condescending...a few eh? I guess they don't count...

If you realy did some research you'd see this is a common occurance throughout the country...

Nobody is denying that individual cases are sometimes handled in a disgusting manner.

Sure they are...you included. Don't change your stance now that I've proven you wrong...

But you are making the claim that abuse from teachers is much more prevalent than abuse from preachers. You have not proven your claim.

Of course I did...you just refuse to see the truth...

One report mandated by Congress estimated that as many as 4.5 million students, out of roughly 50 million in American schools, are subject to sexual misconduct by an employee of a school sometime between kindergarten and 12th grade. That figure includes verbal harassment that's sexual in nature.

I guess 4.5 million is just a few...

Which honestly tends to be your MO

Ahhhhhh ... The sounds of Phreeky grasping at wet blades of barely rooted grass as he slides off the cliff of his own making.

Phree

its people like you who turn us all off to religion. Lets make it so the catholic church looks ok !!!! CAN YOU SAY THE CATHOLICS DID NOT HIDE ABUSE ??? thats the question ? not did other people abuse kids DID THE CATHOLICS ABUSE AND HIDE IT ??? thats it !!! I dont wanna here nothing else !! ADDRESS the CATHOLIC ISSUE !!! that why you an idiot STAY ON TOPIC !!! THIS IS A POPE THREAD !!! NOT A PUBLIC SCHOOL THREAD !!! THE POPE HIDE CHILD MOLESTERS explain how this is GOOD AGIN !!!

Hey 4-F... I'm sure you don't understand this... so I'll explain it to you...

To make your point... you need to prove that disproportionately more kids are molested in public school than private school...

Proof, not conjecture...

Don't worry, it doesn't require knowledge of the Constitution... which you utterly lack...

We're waiting...

I hate the fucking catholic church and will tell anyone who asks. And don't let some troll say I am ignorant of it and that is why. I was born and brainwashed into it, but it didn't stick starting about the time I was 7 or 8.

Why does the Poop wear red shoes?

Because he is a bigoted, backward, fairy tale believing retard you might say?? No, you'd be wrong.

It was a question on the radio this morning and one of our local crapolics called in and explained: it is to represent the blood on Jesus feet at the crucificition.

Laughed my ass off, how lame is that?

Phreedm,

Not a misquote at all...you claimed to have searched and couldn't find any facts to refute my claims...

No, I claimed that I couldn't find any facts to back up your claims. I never made any attempt to refute them. I was asking you to prove the claim that teacher abuse is far worse than preacher abuse. You still have yet to do that.

You made the claim, it's up to your prove it. Why are you so dishonest? Why can't you prove your claim?

Wow...can I use that logic with claims that you have made on here?

Yes, you can. If I have made any claims that I can't back up, then please let me know so I can correct my errors.

A few? You're so arrogant and condescending...a few eh? I guess they don't count...

Arrogant? No. Condescending towards you? Yes.

And you're correct, individual cases can't be used to make general claims.

If you realy did some research you'd see this is a common occurance throughout the country...

Coincidentally that's exactly the conclusion I came to. But the claim you made requires the ability to compare the two sources of abuse. This is exactly the claim that I was chastising you for making. It's a claim that you haven't been able to back up.

Sure they are...you included. Don't change your stance now that I've proven you wrong...

I have not changed my stance. My stance has been than teacher abuse is understudied since I first did the research a few weeks ago. Find a quote from me that says something along the lines of "preacher abuse is worse than teacher abuse." You won't find one which makes you a flat out liar.

Of course I did...you just refuse to see the truth...

One report mandated by Congress estimated that as many as 4.5 million students, out of roughly 50 million in American schools, are subject to sexual misconduct by an employee of a school sometime between kindergarten and 12th grade. That figure includes verbal harassment that's sexual in nature.

That study does nothing to compare the amount of abuse between the two sources. The two sets of data we have are incomparable because the church data comes from a biased source, and only relates to one type of church. Further, the school data applies the word "abuse" much more broadly since it includes verbal comments and not just physical abuse.

How can you compare those two sets of data without knowing how to adjust for errors?

I guess 4.5 million is just a few...

Which honestly tends to be your MO

No, 4.5 million is not just a few. It's a real problem. But you've made up your mind that I don't care about it, so it's time to stop wasting my time with you.

I can't follow the discussion, phreedm? Maybe it's because you make NO SENSE WHATSOEVER.

Hey 4-F...

While you're researching facts to support your latest rants...

Please find where it says "God" or "creator" in the Constitution... as you claimed earlier...

We're waiting...

Sort of OT, there's this story of the head of a Christian school soliciting sex from a mother in exchange for enrolling her daughter in the school. Caught on video!

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/13_undercover&id=6088286

♪♪Bad boys, bad boys, whachagonna do, whachagonna do when they come for you?♪♪

I can't follow the discussion, phreedm? Maybe it's because you make NO SENSE WHATSOEVER.

I'm fairly certain any confusion is a direct result of his obsessive compulsive use of ellipses.

Pedophiles will naturally gravitate towards professions that give them a position of power over children, so my feeling is that the abuse itself has very little to do with either the Catholic Church or public schools in general. And the cover ups can probably be explained by human nature - nobody wants to believe its happening under their watch so often the first reaction is to turn a blind eye to all the warning signs.

At www.thefaithdebate.com you can discuss this issue, share your opinions with others and get to know what other people have to say. Be a part of the debate!

I guess 4-F can't come up with any facts... not surprising...

Better luck next time, freedy...

Phreedm wrote,

So...another claim. Similar to Agustine and Seeker? Time will tell...

?

Don't let the pope's flashy clothes distract you from the religious pedophiles in our midst. I'm in the middle of a custody battle over my boyfriend's two young boys. His wife made a false accusation of sexual abuse to get custody because we were "mentally abusing" the kids by teaching them it was okay not to believe.

In the process of investigating the corrupt organizations contracted by child protection to interview children when there is an accusation of abuse I found out what is behind the widely taught protocol called "Finding Words". At least seventeen states currently use this method.

Behind this drive to teach Finding Words is the director and founder of the National Child Protection Training Center in Winona, Minnesota, a prosecutor named Victor Vieth. Finding Words is not based on science. Vieth doesn’t view an abuse accusation as a crime to be solved or a behavior problem to be understood and addressed with science. Vieth views child sexual abuse as a sin to be punished and all who are accused are guilty. He has described Finding Words as a "train driven by faith" and his naitonwide plan uncludes church involvement as watchdogs over our children.

Vieth is on the board of an organization called GRACE. Godly Response to Child Abuse in a Christian Environment. He has proposed a plan with the Biblical name of "Unto the Third Generation" which he says will end child abuse in 120 years. Basically the plan is to turn the country into a police state where a huge cadre of people trained in his religion based technique watch our every move to make sure we raise our children in the approved manner. Nothing in his plan will do anything to address the issue of child abuse. It’s based on the concept of vengeance not science and he doesn't believe there is any such thing as a false or mistaken accusation.

These people are devouring millions in tax dollars and the lives of our children.

Details of our case and more corruption at www.justicforbjorn.com

a curse on my typo
Try www.justiceforbjorn.com for more info relating to that last comment.