NoGodBlog.com

Finally, someone says it. I could never understand why some people are satisfied with mediocre candidates, and denounce anyone with an actual education or experience as "elitist".

America, if you vote McCain in November, you'll get what you deserve. Obama isn't the perfect candidate for me, but the idea of McCain and Palin leading our country is terrifying. I will happily vote Obama and know that our country won't be any worse for it. McSame will run us into the ground.

I remember a radio interview in 2004 with a lady from Kentucky, who had a very southern accent. She said she was going to vote for G.W. Bush because "he sounds just like me".

We NEED elitists in government. It usually means they have a better than average education and have been exposed to some real ideas in their lifetimes. Good ol boys, and gals, don't have the world view that is needed in the modern world.

The "average" American is NOT qualified for high office. We just have too many of them in those offices now.

The thought of McCain and Palin in the White House scares me. What scares me even more is how many people will vote for them and blithely give up their freedom and well-being. And I say to those people: Yeah, if you want more restrictions and intrusion in your life in the name of "safety" from terrorism, if you want the government telling women what they can or cannot do with their own bodies, if you want to keep on spending billions on a pointless war instead of, oh, I don't know, maybe education and repairing the infrastructure of this nation, and if you really must elect someone that you could go have a beer with, go for it. And be sure to order a mooseburger while you're at it.

Everywhere I go I hear the sentiment expressed by Dave: What a show of disrespect to the presidency and Americans!

McCain shouldn't be allowed on the senate floor let alone in the Oval Office.

As usual Sam is 100% correct!!

From Anchorage Daily News on Palin:

“said she thinks creationism should be taught alongside evolution in the state’s public classrooms.”

Holy cow! So she is going to be a grandma! What the devil does that have to do with whether she is qualified or not?? Let's see, I'm thinking many of our presidents have been GRANDFATHERS but god (or whatever) forbid that we should have a VP who is a GRANDMOTHER! Horrors!

And if you think women will vote for her because of "chromosomes" why do you suppose the majority of blacks are for Obama?

What she does seem to have is judgment and common sense. Why don't we give her a little credit for the good decisions she has made in less than two years as governor of Alaska? And why don't we ask what Obama's accomplishments are? If he is qualifed then Palin is more than qualified. At least she hasn't hung out with people who made bombs and tried to bring down the government, and she hasn't been affiliated with a church where America was damned from the pulpit or had five campaigns financed by a Syrian slum-lord who bilked the government.

If Obama is qualified for the #1 job then IMO Palin is more than qualified for the #2 job and she looks like a quick study to me.

As much as I despise Obamas soc1alist leanings the thought of a McCain-Palin presidency scares the fuck out of me. She is a theocrat and an idiot and given McCains age could very well become president in the event of his death. We can go ahead and kiss our civil liberties, separation of church and state, and advances in gay equality goodbye. As much as I hate to do it, I feel like I might be forced to give up my planned vote for a third party candidate in favour of Obama-Biden. This wouldnt be so much a vote for Obama as it would be a vote against McCain.

GF&G

She has no expertise in anything! Comparing Palin to Obama is funny. You obviously know nothing about Obama.

Get informed. You are scary. Or was your last post a put-on?

What said: "Palin thinks creationism should be taught alongside evolution in the state’s public classrooms.”
That one single statement should be enough to discredit her credibility
to serve in ANY responsible position
let alone that of VP.

What,

I'm betting I know more about Obama than you do and he scares the hell out of me.

Dave's post was sexist and uncalled for.

I don't like her pro-life stance but I can give her credit for what she has accomplished. If you would care to list Obama's accomplishments since he became senator I'm more than willing to listen. And it won't take long. The list, if there is one, will be pitifully short!

I don't know if I would call Palin 'average'. Maybe average in Alaska (I've never been there so really I don't know) and maybe average within the super-far-right wing of assault rifle toting, secessionist leaning, science denying, hoem scoolin, rabid god-warriors, but certainly not average in the sense of 'average voter.'

As jcc suggested in a previous thread, I'm sure that the ultra-conservative 'base' of the GOP will have fun with her being on the ticket. But more libertarian-minded conservatives and swing voters are going to scared shitless of her candidacy, and rightly so.

This is turning out to be a pretty surreal election cycle.

GF&G

Government experience:

Obama has been a Illinois State senator and US senator for 12 years!

Palin? Less than two years as governor in a state where less than 17% of the population of Alaska participated in the election that put her into office.



Pre-Government Expertise:

Obama: An expert in constitutional law with a long legal pedigree.

Palin: Earned nickname of "Sarah Barracuda" because she was an aggressive high school basketball player.



Sounds like you are willing to vote against almost every one of your interests simply because Palin is a women. Blacks are going to vote for Obama simply because he is highly qualified and votes in favor their interests. So don't give me the racial crap.

deja vu?

http://tinyurl.com/5vr9ca

http://tinyurl.com/63grkm

r4d

Deja vu all over again.

That's one heck of a Pastorgate Sarah Pallid has going.

GodFree&Glad said "I can give her credit for what she has accomplished"

Oh come on godfree, you can not be serious, Palin is a complete loony tune. She would replace sex-ed programs with abstinence-only programs, believes abortion should be illegal.She opposes proposals to expand hate-crimes statutes to cover sexual orientation, does not believe that global warming is manmade.In addition, in an interview in May with Fox’s Neil Cavuto, Palin expressed skepticism that climate change is occurring at all.She favors teaching creationism along with evolution in public schools
Nuff said??

Palin's nomination is going to trigger a wave of resume padding in this country so huge that employers will have no idea who they are hiring.

What,

Have you perhaps jumped to a conclusion about who I intend to vote for? I don't believe I said either way.

Okay so Obama has a fancy law degree. Sorry, but a fancy degree doesn't necessarily make him good presidential material. Anybody who cares to hang around a university long enough can usually come out with an advanced degree. I've personally known several Ph.D's who were anything but brilliant.

And I notice you failed to list Obama's accomplishments other than his Harvard degree. I'll ask again: what has the guy accomplished?

I don't know that Ronald Reagan was brilliant but the guy, whether you liked him or not, managed to bring down the Berlin Wall and end the cold war without a shot being fired. Darwin was a C student. Ike was somewhere in the middle of his class as I recall, but without him we might not have prevailed in WWII. Clinton, on the other hand, had the smarts and IMO did a fairly decent job as president, but he didn't have common sense enough to keep his pants zipped.

So Obama has a fancy resume but other than being a neighborhood organizer (whatever that is?) I don't see anything the guy has actually done except write a couple of books about himself and give a good speech. Talk, by the way, is dirt cheap.

OMG this just keeps getting better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrG8w4bb3kg

I love living in the age of youtube.

GF&G

Here's a partial list:

http://tinyurl.com/329zfc

Wholey crap! How difficult is it for one to find out what Obama's record is? It takes literally seconds and yet some folks wont even put out that much effort.

r4d

Thanks for the link. Gotta love those open mics!

The Plain nomination caused me to donate another $200 to the Obama campaign again. And I get a free T-shirt! I'm up to $600 at this point. Best money I have ever spent in the name of good government and the separation of church and state.

Plain nomination -> Pallid nomination

Speaking before the Pentecostal church, Palin painted the current war in Iraq as a messianic affair in which the United States could act out the will of the Lord.
"Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God," she exhorted the congregants. "That's what we have to make sure that we're praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God's plan."
Religion, however, was not strictly a thread in Palin's foreign policy. It was part of her energy proposals as well. Just prior to discussing Iraq, Alaska's governor asked the audience to pray for another matter -- a $30 billion national gas pipeline project that she wanted built in the state. "I think God's will has to be done in unifying people and companies to get that gas line built, so pray for that," she said.
Now just imagine, what if she had asked people to act out the will of Mars and that our troops were on a task that was from Thor.
Would the godbots still think she was such a great choice?
Since when as anyone provided more evidence for the Xtian god than Mars ot Thor?

More fun stuff:

http://tinyurl.com/67rrfc

Some of you make me absolutely sick to my stomach.

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

Those are the qualifications for office. They are in our Constitution.

No person is forbidden from running for the office. It is the absolute right of the people to self-governance by any eligible citizen lawfully elected to hold the office.

I respect Sam Harris' opinions on a number of topics. I will not stoop to idolatry merely because of my respect for a fellow atheist, his popularity among atheist circles, or how much money he's managed to make selling books.

The Constitution was written the way that it was so that a ruling class could be not formed. Washington insiders and the social elite are not the voice of the people.

I'm sure that the experience gained in Congress for attaching riders and hiding pork in necessary appropriations bills and the deftness with which agreements can be arranged to vote for bills that are betrayals of your constituents' trust in you is fine experience indeed. It's experience one certainly can use to manipulate the powers that be against the will of the people.

AT,

Some of you make me absolutely sick to my stomach.

Terrible way to open your debate, in my opinion. Aren't you the one often claiming to teach us how to debate?

Those are the qualifications for office. They are in our Constitution.

What's your point? No one above (at least that I understood) has mentioned setting some sort of socio-economic or educational standard to hold office — or any standard at all beyond those set in the constitution.

From what I read, most just want someone in office they feel is intellectually capable to serve. There was a time when Americans' wanted the best they had to offer for the office of president. That's the point being made. Why is it — do you think — this attitude has changed?

Terrible way to open your debate, in my opinion. Aren't you the one often claiming to teach us how to debate?

That is a statement of opinion, not subject to debate, nor a proffered topic of debate.

What's your point? No one above (at least that I understood) has mentioned setting some sort of socio-economic or educational standard to hold office — or any standard at all beyond those set in the constitution.

My point is that, for all the fine words, statements like "Americans have an unhealthy desire to see average people promoted to positions of great authority" are an exaggeration of the truth. The truth is that our country has no such requirements.

I do believe that Americans wage a popularity contest more than we do an election every four years, but that is also a matter of opinion.

From what I read, most just want someone in office they feel is intellectually capable to serve. There was a time when Americans' wanted the best they had to offer for the office of president. That's the point being made. Why is it — do you think — this attitude has changed?

A vast majority (80%) of her constituency believes she is capable of serving their interests. Is their perspective any less American than yours, or mine?

This whole post is merely "appeal to authority": Sam Harris is a popular atheist. You are atheists. Therefore, you should accept his opinion on politics.

I keep asking to see some real dirt. I want to see a good, logical argument that is based on the facts for why we should demonize this woman. I've seen some nasty smears, but I am still awaiting something more compelling.

AT

I keep asking to see some real dirt.

I'm sure we could post all sorts of dirt on her. The problem is that one person's dirt is often another person's gold.

But really, if this is supposed to be about what's in the best interests of secularists or even moderates, then Palin clearly is not an acceptable candidate.

Obama has been a Illinois State senator and US senator for 12 years!

Palin? Less than two years as governor in a state where less than 17% of the population of Alaska participated in the election that put her into office.

Why not at least try and be a bit more honest?

Palin’s tenure as Alaska governor equals, if not exceeds, Obama in experience. Palin, 44, has spent 12 years in elected office: 10 years as a city councilor and mayor and nearly two as governor. Obama, 47, has also spent 12 years in office: eight years as a state senator and close to four as a U.S. senator.

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/?s=palin

Uh oh, it's those horrible CATO guys again (I chose their article specifically for you), get ready to direct some more ad hominem attacks their way for stating some facts.

I'm sure we could post all sorts of dirt on her. The problem is that one person's dirt is often another person's gold.

I suppose I should be more clear here, I mean some hard incontrovertible facts. I'd like to see something that proves that she is likely to act on her religious beliefs in any of the ways that many of you have alluded to.

I don't mean the tabloid-variety trash that has so far been dragged to this blog and dumped here in all its steaming glory.

Atomic

If you think that serving as a city councilor or mayor of a town of population 5,469 should qualify as applicable government experience then you are welcome to include it in YOUR list. I think most Americans would not put it in theirs.

You really should learn what your beloved logical fallacies are. They are a set of rules for debating much like the Marcus of Queensbury rules are for boxing. Next time you go to a Karate match you can complain that they aren't following Marcus of Queensbury rules. These fallacies that you are obsessed with are not the axioms of classical logic.

Atomics argument

You can't prove that Sarah Pallid isn't qualified therefore she must be.

Sound familiar?

AT

That is a statement of opinion, not subject to debate, nor a proffered topic of debate.

You open your post with a statement that insults those you're trying to convince, that was my point — not whether or not your opinion was part of your debate. But of course, you already know this.

My point is that, for all the fine words, statements like "Americans have an unhealthy desire to see average people promoted to positions of great authority" are an exaggeration of the truth. The truth is that our country has no such requirements.

First, the statement "Americans have an unhealthy desire to see average people promoted to positions of great authority" is not an exaggeration of the truth. It's an interpretation of the reality of how Americans' are voting. I believe this interpretation to be accurate since many polls show Americans' are voting based on how they relate to a candidate and not on the qualifications of one.

Second, that statement says nothing about law-based requirements for political office.

A vast majority (80%) of her constituency believes she is capable of serving their interests. Is their perspective any less American than yours, or mine?

No. I'm sure she serves the 80 percent of Alaska's voting population perfectly well. And she appears well qualified to run a state that has less than half the population of the city in which I live, and almost no developed land. But her qualifications are less than adequate, in my opinion, to hold the office of VP (or possibly President) and saying so is perfectly American.

It seems to me if voting for one's drinking buddy is what Americans' are doing, then that ‘perspective’ is American.

Just for the record, I'm not nearly as concerned with Palin's lack of experience as I am with her religious-based positions. I'm not a one-issue guy. I'm willing to compromise. But Palin's religious stance on so many issues is why (for me) she is not an acceptable choice as VP.

AT

I'd like to see something that proves that she is likely to act on her religious beliefs in any of the ways that many of you have alluded to.

What?? Her entire shtick is that she acts on her religious beliefs. That is what she is about, and it's exactly why McCain picked her. They needed some red meat for the Dobson crowd, and they thought they would get a twofer with the fact that she's young and a woman. You think he picked her because of her governing experience? Please.

I think the fact that the GOP convention has once again devolved into culture-warrior shrillness speaks volumes. They can't tout their record, and they can no longer legitimately tout experience. They might be sneaky and try to tout reform, but not enough folks are going to buy that line because this is largely a referendum on the party itself. Nope, all they have left are cultural issues, and that means religious literalism and denialism.

Let's see how the vote comes out. I think we get the government we deserve.

Ha. Interesting post from TIME's (that mudslinging tabloid) Joe Klein:

http://tinyurl.com/6errum

Godfrey,

If he is qualifed then Palin is more than qualified. At least she hasn't hung out with people who made bombs and tried to bring down the government.

If you will recall from seventh grade civics class, our founding fathers made bombs and overthrew their government.

Tag, you're it!

Atomic

As president of the Law Review Obama managed twice as much staff as did Palin as mayor and nobody I know is counting his Law Review position as governmental experience.

AT,

I'd like to see something that proves that she is likely to act on her religious beliefs in any of the ways that many of you have alluded to.

I could be wrong, but aren't evangelicals required by law, or something, to 'spread the gosphel' as it were? Why WOULDN'T she use her position to proselytize?

DVan,

Just for the record, I'm not nearly as concerned with Palin's lack of experience as I am with her religious-based positions. I'm not a one-issue guy. I'm willing to compromise. But Palin's religious stance on so many issues is why (for me) she is not an acceptable choice as VP.

Very well stated. Ramen!

well mccain cemented florida with his pick. at the office today all the xtian republicans were whooping it up. they are happy with the addition of this brain-washed religious nutjob.

palin is perfect for florida with all our religious wackos. creationism as science, banning abortions, teaching abstinence are all cornerstones of the neanderthal mentality that pervades this state.

i need to move out of here.

the best quote of the week so far goes to cindy mccain. when asked about palin's foreign policy experience, she actually said with a straight face that alaska is closer to russia that the rest of the country and therefore palin has foreign policy experience. how can anyone argue with such sound republican logic??

no don't this civil rights crap has gotten out of hand.yet it is true
she is not bad looking and unlike cheney she has not shot anyone.so what if she is nuts have you met a woman who isn't.

Comment from: What

She has no expertise in anything! Comparing Palin to Obama is funny. You obviously know nothing about Obama.

"What...do I know"...once again you prove your ignorance. The point is we all DO know NObama's lack of experience...

As for Sam's piece...

It's obvious he must have had several editors help him write his book...or perhaps he wasn't feeling good when he put pen to paper...

The funny thing is, he just slammed all of you and you're all groveling at his feet...

Say "What..do I know"...exactly what is a "community organizer"...?

alaska is also closer to santa claus.

phreedm
if a woman isn't good enough to be a priest she sure as heck isn't going enough to be a heartbeat away from president.pull down your pants and remind yourself you are a man.women have no business in public office.

going = good

No..that's not an earthquake in the upper midwest...

It's the first tremor placing a highly qualified, highly respected, most popular Gov. in America, into the 2nd highest public office we have to offer...

I'll make another prediction...NObama won't win more then 15 states...

Sleep well Sam...

phreedm
she is not respected you just have the hots for her.

15 states is enough of the electoral college to win...

Can we get a over/under pool going?

To all those Catholics out there cheering for Palin, I was just wondering: How come a woman can be VP, but not a priest? Is it because women priests would expose the men priests for the pedophiles they are?

What,

You can't prove that Sarah Pallid isn't qualified therefore she must be.

I stated that there is no requirement by our Constitution that the President or Vice President have any political experience whatsoever.

Keep on spinning and misrepresenting. Gotta stick with what you're good at, right?

I know little of boxing, but they're called the Marquess of Queensberry rules. I, at least, knew that. You apparently know as little about boxing as you know about anything else.

Marquess (or marquis) is a title and a remnant of the feudal system. Marcus is a male name with a long history of use.

As far as the comparison between a set of boxing rules and the rules for debate are concerned, are you claiming that an argument poorly supported is as effective as one supported by the rules of debate?

To use your comparison we're either to use the rules of debate, or none at all. You kill your own arguments as soon as they leave your mouth (or you hit the "Send comment" button anyway). I know of no boxing rules by which you can win inflicting all of the blows to yourself. You play by some odd rules indeed.

Oh well, I can't say that it isn't a little entertaining to watch you keep doing this to yourself.

As president of the Law Review Obama managed twice as much staff as did Palin as mayor and nobody I know is counting his Law Review position as governmental experience.

I don't care. His qualifications in law don't interest me as they are also not necessary for running the country. I know where he stands on fiscal policy and I don't like it. No amount of idol worship on your part is going to make me "see the light." Phreedm doesn't even try to proselytize to me anymore.

You have not learned that yet. In at least that one small way, he's certainly smarter than you are. You are a political wingnut in the same way that he is a religious one and you are equally good at presenting an argument.

The only thing I've seen evidence of in the past few days is that quite a few atheists are cultishly liberal, they're terrible at supporting an argument, and that they are exceedingly petty when it comes to anything being said or done by anyone outside of that cult.

I've repeatedly asked for concrete proof that this VP pick has used religion a political rather than personal way. The kinds of things I'd like to see are appropriations to fund churches or church programs or unconstitutional bills passed (rather than vetoed) that are a direct result of religious conviction. She has a pretty long history in politics, even if it's mostly politics on a local level. There has to be something in there that would raise a red flag if there are flags to be raised.

So far all I've seen dragged up here is wild-eyed screaming over speculation (and poorly-supported speculation at that) and tabloid-quality trash. Aren't we better than this?

Oh lookie, Bristol's fiance is there, and he looks Soooooooo happy.

AT,

I know where he stands on fiscal policy and I don't like it.

You're not saying you are a single issue voter, are you?

did palin plan on having another child or was this unplanned.the whole thing sounds shady i'm not talking about incest but along the lines that just like male politicians she places her needs before her family.

reason,

Seeing as how her idea of birth control is the rythm method, my guess is that it was an ooooopsie.

I'm surprised I haven't heard any talk of outlawing tubal ligations and vasectomies, thus condemning the rest of us to the same fate.

Questions people, questions!

Question:

Should I dare watch Palin's speech on the internets and risk projectile vomiting all over my keyboard or should I just wait until tomorrow on the daily show/colbert report so it is interrupted by funny?

Ron Paul has had a good convention across the river.

Comment from: reason

she is not respected you just have the hots for her.

Wow..you must be trying to make a joke...

Climbing on board the sexist train is the last thing I'd expect from you...

Not respected? Tell that to the politicians in Alaska...

Tell that to the Big Oil executives...

If she's not respected, then why is her approval rating over 80%?

Comment from: Ren

But Palin's religious stance on so many issues is why (for me) she is not an acceptable choice as VP.

So you do support a "religious test"...

Simply...more hypocrisy...

"Climbing on board the sexist train is the last thing I'd expect from you..."

Like how right wing talking heads are doing?

"If she's not respected, then why is her approval rating over 80%?"

It's Alaska. Nobody bothered to vote to begin with and the people who did are obviously liking her.

"So you do support a "religious test"...

Simply...more hypocrisy..."

Perhaps because such stances are illegal, not because they are religious? It isn't a religious test to say that palin is an unqualified nut who supports creationism, its just common sense.

You're not saying you are a single issue voter, are you?

That's a weird way to put it. Fiscal policy covers a bunch of things (one of the most substantial differences between political parties). The biggest single issue under that, for me, is my opposition to universal healthcare. I don't like the idea of a Democratic congress and President rubber-stamping the money straight out of my wallet. I don't like the idea of more growth of the federal government.

I can't see what other answer you'd have expected me to give though. It's not like I am hiding the fact that I am a staunch fiscal conservative. On that accord, I am hearing more of the kinds of things I'd like to hear from McCain than Obama.

What is the liberal incantation or ritual that damns a Libertarian to hell for eternity, anyway? I'm just saving What the trouble of asking after my last statement (if he doesn't die first from a massive coronary just considering the mere possibility of an atheist that isn't hailing Obama as a messiah).

Comment from: Asemodeus

Perhaps because such stances are illegal, not because they are religious?

Hmmm...huh?

It isn't a religious test to say that palin is an unqualified nut who supports creationism, its just common sense.

Is that you "What...do I know"?

He's the only one who'd make such an ignorant statment...

Unqualified...? OK. Show me one example about either NObama or Biden that stacks up to this...

AT,

I don't like the idea of a Democratic congress and President rubber-stamping the money straight out of my wallet.

But you are fine with insurance companies raising your rates and curtailing your services?

The government is not in the business of making money. Insurance companies are. If managed correctly, socalized medicine will cost us less, not more. How else do you explain that America spends more on healthcare, per capita, than any other country in the world, and we have 50 million uninsured and millions more that cannot afford their deductables, so in effect, can't go to the doctor even though they are insured?

Part 2

A Negotiator Without Preconditions

http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=13809

Watch how this relative of "What...do I know" shows us how not to be a reporter...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjGhy8LVwAo

Comment from: Ren

The government is not in the business of making money.

BINGO...!!! That's why government services are such poor quality.

NO ACCOUNTABILITY!!!

It's exactly why we have the term..."snail mail"...

It's exactly why you dread a trip to the Motor Vehicle Department...

It's exactly why 72 cents of a tax dollar goes to administration costs...

It's nice to see you're finally starting to understand the benefits of Capita1ism over Socia1ism...

So you do support a "religious test"...

No, but I also do not support a candidate that would force his/her religiosity on me. There should be no religious test to be an American, either, and yet my children are tested on that very subject each morning when they are forced to confirm alegience to god during the pledge. Yes, I said forced. They are very young and would be instantly ostracized if they didn't go along with the crowd. If that's not forced, I don't know what is.

"Unqualified...? OK. Show me one example about either NObama or Biden that stacks up to this..."

If she doesn't even know, or just ignores it for political gain, that creationism is illegal, then why again was she picked for vp?

Don't try to change the subject again phree. Palin supports anti-science nonsense, she has no right to be in any position of power.

If she supported the equal teaching of the stork theory with actual reality of pregnancy people would be rightfully pissed off.

AT:

Fiscal policy covers a bunch of things (one of the most substantial differences between political parties). The biggest single issue under that, for me, is my opposition to universal healthcare. I don't like the idea of a Democratic congress and President rubber-stamping the money straight out of my wallet.

Wow, I can't stay outta this ridiculous argument you're making.
It's a matter of historical fact that America does better under Democrats than it ever has under Repiglickans (don't care if that's an ad hominem on your scorecard or not).
Your arguments are weak, & you're voting w/your wallet. Which means your vote is for sale. Congrats.
As for the free market being a cure-all for everything, that's just ideological crack.
It's like libertarians have blinders on to the fact that there are administrative costs.
People have cited multiple reasons why Palin isn't fit for office. But as you say, there's only the constitutional requirements as the bar. Oh, & the voters.
Which means a Manson or a Bundie could run for office. & maybe even win.
The Republican party should be abolished. It's ruined this country several times over. It's done nothing but harm.
'Fiscally conservative' my homesick ass.

NO ACCOUNTABILITY!!!

So government isn't accountable (to their constituents), but big business IS accountable? Riiiiight... to their shareholders!

It's exactly why we have the term..."snail mail"...

42 cents to get a letter anywhere in the world in a couple days to a week, or so... Quite a bargain, wouldn't you say?

It's exactly why you dread a trip to the Motor Vehicle Department...

I live in Nebraska. I don't dread going to the DMV. I just renewed my license less than a week ago. Took less than 15 minutes from the time I walked in the door of the courthouse and I had to go to two separate parts of the bulding. One to have my eyes checked, the other to have my picture taken and my license issued and make a check out for $24.

On top of that, I got new tabs for my car just yesterday, and it only took 5 minutes, and I hit the bathroom on the way out. I didn't think it was painful at all.

It's exactly why 72 cents of a tax dollar goes to administration costs...

Reference please? Otherwise it is just hearsay.

Capita1ism over Socia1ism...

Let's try that one more time.

Capita1ism over Socia1ism...

Capitalism: The idea that greed is good and god is the almighty dollar.

Socia1ism: The idea that people come first and business does not have the same legal standing as an individual.

Bottom line here:

The Republicans have been in power for almost eight years. They have screwed up everything they have touched. (Yes, my opinion, phreedm) Thus, they do not deserve my vote. I don't have to vote for Obama (I will, though) - there are other choices that can be made.

Voting republican is a validation of the last eight years. If you like what's happened in this time, you should vote McSame-Palin. And you deserve it.

In fact, wasn't it H.L. Mencken who said "Democracy is the form of government where the people know what they want - and deserve to get it good and hard." ?

Phreedm

NO ACCOUNTABILITY!!!

Really? Just what do you call voting, then?

Socialiism and Capitalism: No contest. Three of the worst things in the modern world are Capitalism, Christianity, and Competitiveness.

We would be better served with Socialiism, Atheism, and Cooperation.

(I know it's misspelled - the filter won't let the correct spelling through.)

Atomic

The following part of your post is all I really need to address of your irrational (really man, crack a book on logic) spew.

The only thing I've seen evidence of in the past few days is that quite a few atheists are cultishly liberal, they're terrible at supporting an argument, and that they are exceedingly petty when it comes to anything being said or done by anyone outside of that cult.

What a hoot. Accusations of cultism from a member of Americas only political cult - The Libertarian Party. Face it, your political ideology has never been tested and never will be tested because people don't need to drop a hammer on their foot to know that it's going to hurt. So sit back and cry about how the rest of the world would be so much better off if they would only accept, without question and without tests of efficacy, the models constructed within your delusion.

One more thing - Marcus -> Marquess. I have said it before and will say it again. He who corecs da spell'n ov odders n da commenz secshun of blog is AN INANE DRONE.

Dorky Mommy

Capitalism is a religion to some people.

What's clear is many of you really do support a theocracy....

Just your type of theocracy...

Comment from: rainbows4dinosaurs

NO ACCOUNTABILITY!!!

Really? Just what do you call voting, then?

Hey r4d...last time we had a discussion you ran off with your tail between your legs...

But to your question...

In most states in the union we don't vote for Motor Vehicle employees...

nor for State Highway employees...

Comment from: Dorky Mommy

We would be better served with Socialiism, Atheism, and Cooperation.

I'm always impressed when one's comments reflect their screen name...

I'm still waiting for any NObama supporter to match Palin's record with NObama...

And "What...do I know"....

What is a "community organizer"?

Come now...you're one of the loudest mouth pieces...surely you should have some type of anwer...

BINGO...!!! That's why government services are such poor quality.

Exactly what government services do you receive, and what makes them such poor quality? More importantly, why are you receiving them if they are of such poor quality? Why don't you let the free market handle 'that' for ya?

Or is this another case of you spouting talking points without a clue as to what you are actually talking about? Kind of like how I lived in a socia1ist country for six years, but I have no clue what I am talking about. You, on the other hand, have never lived anywhere but the good ol' US of A, and you know all about the evils of socia1ism.

You know, I grew up with socia1ism being a dirty word, too. Then I moved to Germany and discovered the whole, "There's no country on earth as wonderful as the United States" was just a load of Bullshit. That's propaganda, to you and me. Europeans are on average, much less religious, much more liberal, and much happier than their American counterparts. So their GDP may not be what ours is. Big whoop! There is more to life than making money, which just goes to prove my point; your god is the almighty dollar!

Holy cow! So she is going to be a grandma! What the devil does that have to do with whether she is qualified or not?? Let's see, I'm thinking many of our presidents have been GRANDFATHERS but god (or whatever) forbid that we should have a VP who is a GRANDMOTHER! Horrors!

I gotta agree with this one. I'm not NOT voting for Palin because she claims she's going to be a grandmother. Can we leave the grandmother status out of this? Apparently Dave is unaware that grandmothers make this world go around! And grandfathers hold it together. Let's not diss our elders.

I have to kinda agree with Nuclear Nads. I don't think there should be an elitist quality among our politicians as it definetly develops a "ruling class". Perhaps the founders were on to something, no? I do, however, expect our politicians to be educated, be able to publically speak (and mean what they say), and to at least be a "people person" who can connect with John and Jane Doe and recognize who their bosses really are (hint: NOT CORPORATIONS!!!!)

Still, the proliferation of religious "law" into America practically paralizes me with terror. I keep envisioning the Dark Ages. The fact the Palin is condoning this shotgun wedding makes me want to bitch-slap her. Fuck her and her ilk. I will not sell out my liberty for a few tax breaks (that usually only benefit the rich) or brownie points with their gawd. And I've no doubt that the RR (aka Palin, I'm not even sure if I would put McCain into that catagory) would happily inject their stoooopid death cult into my life COVERTLY and consistently until one day, maybe when I'm 90ish, I'll be arrested for refusing to go to their church of the poisoned minds. And then I'll wonder, when did this happen?

Ren,
I earn much more in the free market in my 401ks than I will ever see from SS tax.

And unless you live in a squat & eat out of garbage cans, part of your life is about making money. Some people devote more time & energy, others less. Do not expect everyone to live by your standards.

Racer X:

And unless you live in a squat & eat out of garbage cans, part of your life is about making money.

True enough, but that's only part of your life. People shouldn't live for money, they should live on it.

I feel that both parties offer important ideas that should be viewed rather than dismissed. But the democratic party offers one thing that the republican and conservative party do not, compassion.
Last night Palin got a standing ovation for saying that liberals protest that terrorists in custody have rights. The Vietcong viewed mccain as a terrorist, yet we deride them for the torture he endured.
Republicans put a cash value on all things that add to the quality of life for the least members of society and then try to villify them for thier needs.
but I assure you, if Palins fortunes were to change she would be the first to look to the goverment for aid in raising the little downs kid she poped out.

mx,

I earn much more in the free market in my 401ks than I will ever see from SS tax.

People in socia1ist countries don't invest in retirement plans? That's news to me.

Tell me, when you bring your paycheck home, is that YOUR money, or your families' money? Who's more patriotic; the person who looks out for himself and only himself, or a person that cares about his fellow Americans?

You do of course realize that if we had a pay as you go system in place in this country, (no deficit spending) you would have made nowhere near what you did in your 401K? I hope you enjoy your money, 'cause your grandchildren are paying for it. The national debt is a birth tax!

ga4ry,

You are right about people like Palin. My neighbor across the street is a die-hard Republican. He also has a daughter that was hit by a car and paralyzed from the neck down, over twenty years ago. She requires round the clock care by a nurse practitioner. There are three different cars across the street, alternating every eight hours, twenty-four hours a day, every day.

Now, I'm not my brother's keeper, but his wife has not worked since her daughter was so terribly injured, and he lost his job two years ago, is currently not working, and is not old enough to have retired and draw SS, yet, somehow, they have managed to keep their house AND maintain 24hour a day nursing care for their daughter. I wonder how they do it, if not for the government?

These are the same people that look down their noses at me because I draw a pension from the VA. Go figure!

Tell me Preedm,what will happen to the US leadership if the rapture happens within her term.
Since McCain's gone born again Southern Baptist, and she's a raving fundie, who will be left to run the government when those two fly up to heaven?
Are there any contingency plans drawn up?

"I'm still waiting for any NObama supporter to match Palin's record with NObama..."

I'm still waiting for you to address why anybody who is anti-science should be in any position of power.

Ren:

People in socia1ist countries don't invest in retirement plans? That's news to me.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. SS is funded by an illegal pyramid scheme & is not invested. It is not voluntary. Myself & probably everyone else not in the bottom 10% is losing a shit ton of money on this badly run & poorly managed program. If this is not caring about others, I don't know what is.

When I bring my paycheck home, it's mine, I have no one dependent on me & I'm not dependent on anyone else. This is neither patriotic or unpatriotic. You can thank me & every other gay & single person for subsidizing your family & public schools.

I do not plan on procreating, as that is one thing I cannot afford & I would not expect other taxpayers to pay for my choice of hobby.

Ren

I pointed out to Mx last week that SS is in part a safety net so that the government doesn't have to bail out the large number inevitable losers in the investment game. He appears to think that the investment player always wins in the long run. Well it depends upon when you start and stop the clock. Like those folks that fell for the home-prices-never-decrease ponzi scheme he will soon be awaken.

Ren

Mx also does not seem to realize that if his taxes were to decrease the market in which he works would decrease wages. The employer knows what the market will bear with respect to wages and will adjust appropriately.

There are two mechanisms by which the wage earner can increase thei standard of living: make yourself more marketable and collective bargaining. Vote for a party whose goal has been to destroy that second mechanism is economic suicide.

Phreedm

Hey r4d...last time we had a discussion you ran off with your tail between your legs...

Huh? How exactly does one do that on a blog? Are you saying I failed to respond to maybe one or two of your inane queries? Could it be I often have more important things to do than spare with far right radicals on some obscure corner of the internets? Could it be that I have a family and a job and LIFE to live that doesn't put our conversations on any sort of priority list?

In most states in the union we don't vote for Motor Vehicle employees...
nor for State Highway employees...

We don't vote on ANY employees, private or public. But government programs can be slashed with new administrations just as private companies slash their workforce when profits drop and competition increases, usually from overseas.

And when it comes to something like health care, again, MOST OF US DON'T HAVE ANY CHOICE. We get the health plan handed to us through our employers, and we can't do anything about those 'benefits' being slashed every year. Maybe we can shop for a job with a better package, but for most folks this usually comes with an offset in salary. So ya'll conservatives and libertarians can save us the whole 'free market=choice' argument concerning our healthcare, or that public healthcare would cut into our wages (private healthcare already does, geniuses.) Anyone connected to reality is going to automatically know that such talking points are vacuous bullshit.

Ahhhh! You guys are all over the place. It's like sitting in Congress listening to all of them speak at the same time.
Let me add one more voice to the Pandemonium.

On another thread a member said something to the affect, "I share phreedumb's excitement about McBush's pick" implying he had tripped on his dick. Oh, wait!! That was me.

Another member said he could not wait for the vice-presidential debates.

The speech Palin gave last night makes me think that we both tripped on our dicks. This is a well spoken, obviously inteligent opponent, definitely on the level of Obama for turning a phrase. This woman is the real thing. She did little to confront any political issues, just like Michelle Obama. She was there to humanize herself to the nation, and she was brilliant. She did step on her tongue once(she doesn't have dick as far as I know), she implied, as a parent of a special needs child, that all special needs children would have and advocate in a McBush administration, but the reality is that parents of disabled children in Alaska hate her with a passion. One of her first "fiscally conservative" acts as a governor was to cut the budget for "special needs" children by 60 percent. This in a state that has so much money they pay you to live there. That and, I'm guessing, a few other things are going to come back to haunt her.
But, hate her for what she represents, or whatever, this girl is the real thing. Don't underestimate the stupidity of American voters.

NeoWolfe

mx,

I'm not sure what you mean by this. SS is funded by an illegal pyramid scheme & is not invested.

I was referring to your 401K, not SS. And people in socia1ist countries buy stocks and bonds and invest, as well as having a social safety net.

Myself & probably everyone else not in the bottom 10%

You're in the bottom ten percent, and you have a 401K? How does someone that lives in abject poverty, afford to sock money away in a 401K? You are aware that benefits received from SS, are directly proprotional to how much you pay into it, aren't you?

...this badly run & poorly managed program

No argument here.

When I bring my paycheck home, it's mine, I have no one dependent on me & I'm not dependent on anyone else.

I was healthy and independant once, also. Did you ever think that you are only one injury, one illness, one car accident away from being totally dependant on others for the rest of your life? Or, does that only happen to OTHER people?

You can thank me & every other gay & single person for subsidizing your family & public schools.

First and foremost, I will have you know that I have two children and two children only. Did that on purpose by having a vasectomy less than a month after my daughter was born. I think pwople that have large families are selfish!!!

Secondly, as a !00% disabled vet, I qualify for what is known as a homestead tax exemption, which would wipe out all my property taxes for the rest of my life. I have never applied for said exemption, because I feel it is my duty to pay those taxes, because schools are funded by property taxes, and I have two in school. So you are not subsidizing MY children. You are subsidizing people like the Duggars and the Romneys, and other large Catholic and LDS families.

I do not plan on procreating, as that is one thing I cannot afford & I would not expect other taxpayers to pay for my choice of hobby.

You are to be commended. I wish more people felt that way. You need to understand though, that I am not seeking to have the U.S. become a socia1ist country, just that there are certain things that socia1ist countries do well, like universal healthcare, that we should emulate.

Why is it that we already spend more on healthcare per capita, than any other country in the world, yet we have 50 million plus uninsured? Could it be the thousands of insurance companies, all out to make a profit for their shareholders, that is the problem? I say yes.

Why don't I hear any complaints about socia1ized medicine for the military and veterans? What about our socia1ized farming practices, where we pay farmers to NOT grow food, keeping the price of certain commodities artificially high?

I could go on, but my head is splitting. I need to go lay back down.

One last thing. I didn't realize you were gay. I am sure you must have mentioned it before and I just missed it, but that is beside the point. If you ever find yourself in a stable relationship, and you can afford to raise a child (don't kid yourself, you will never be able to AFFORD to raise a child) I suggest you try adopting, if that is an option for you. I never wanted children, but I have them, and they are the most wonderful part of life. I doubt I would still be alive but for the thought of what would it do to them if I 'offed' myself.

mx,

Myself & probably everyone else not in the bottom 10%

Do'h! My bad! I told you my head was splitting. I will be laying down now:-(

If you want to be poor and have a crashed economy, then vote Obama/Biden.

http://irrationaltheorist.blogspot.com/2008/08/why-obama-is-liability.html

However, if you want the USA to have a healthy economy, then vote McCain/Palin.

"However, if you want the USA to have a healthy economy, then vote McCain/Palin."

If you want candidates that lie and claim that the Constitution makes America a christian nation, pick McCain/Palin.